Same Old Story For Phils With 11-6 Loss – Phillies Nation

Same Old Story For Phils With 11-6 Loss

What did we say was the Phillies biggest concern heading into the offseason?

I seem to forget …

Oh yes! Pitching!

The Phillies didn’t get it against the Nationals today, losing 11-6. Brett Myers looked mindless, giving up four runs while walking two and hitting two batters. Ryan Madson surrendered a two-run home run.

Despite the bad beginning, the Phillies were able to keep the game close. A first inning run was manufactured by a Jimmy Rollins double, a Shane Victorino sacrifice bunt and a Chase Utley sacrifice fly. Then home runs by Utley and Rollins pulled it to a tie.

But Tom Gordon entered our lives.

He gave up five earned while only getting two outs. He was horrible. Absolutely horrible. Yes, defense did no favors, as Rollins committed two blunders, but Gordon was not good at all. Clearly, he’s not supposed to be pitching in high-pressure situations. Example No. 1 the Phillies did not own up on their offseason concerns.

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  1. VA Steve

    March 31, 2008 at 6:09 pm

    Hey Gillick and owners, are you happy now? We are one, maybe two players away from making a serious run. Unfortunately, we don’t have owners and management that is serious about a championship.

  2. Lewisauce

    March 31, 2008 at 6:26 pm

    Is this ownership’s idea of a god-damn joke? Tom Freakin’ Gordon is the f**king closer? This is an insult to the city, the fans, the guys like Jimmy and Chase and even Burrell who go out and play every day.

    Madson’s ERA is at 18.00, which makes him a considerably better pitcher than Tater Gordon. Five runs in two-thirds of an inning? I think that puts him at 47.50 or something. This is unreal.

    Get used to it, Brothers and Sisters. This is our bullpen. This is our closer. This is the next six months of our lives. Get used to the soundtrack of clown music every time Charlie strolls out of the dugout in the sixth inning. Get used to the delusions of Adam Eaton, who will tell you he “felt fine” and had “pretty good stuff, except for one or two that they go ahold of” after every loss in which he unravels for five runs in the third inning. Get used to the party-line toting of Charlie Manuel (who knows he’s been given the worst collection of slop and leftovers ever assembled and yet, somehow, is expected to turn it into a bullpen strong enough to compete against the Mets and Braves).

    You thought you were fed up with Ed Wade by the time he left? Wait ’til we’re 4-12 again, and the thunder is being called down on Gillick and Co.

    Absolute joke. Best offense in the NL. Ownership had money to spend (they offered $7 mil per year to Lohse) and then decided to … what? Save some cash and pay next to nothing for Rule V and waiver garbage instead?

    Get used to it. We’re in for a long, nasty summer.

  3. chris m

    March 31, 2008 at 6:31 pm

    didnt he to do this last opening day?? why is eevryone giving him so much credit?? he only got one out(many things i want to say abewt tom gordan but ill restrain for everyone elses sake)

  4. NateB

    March 31, 2008 at 7:04 pm

    Gordon’s ERA is 135.00 (one hundred and thirty-five). Can he keep that up this season? Looks like the Phils want to make records for runs in both batting and pitching…

  5. Bill B.

    March 31, 2008 at 7:22 pm

    Ryan Madson got owned by Edgar Renteria in last year’s home opener. He got owned the next night by Scott Thorman in the top of the 11th by giving up a go-ahead and eventual game-winning solo HR.

    Tom Gordon gave up a ninth-inning, game-tying two-run homer to Brian McCann in the second game of 2007.

    “Is this ownership’s idea of a god-damn joke? Tom Freakin’ Gordon is the f**king closer? This is an insult to the city[…]”

    While I share your disdain towards ownership, they did get Brad Lidge. Granted, he’s had two knee surgeries already and he’s on the D.L., but he is a dominant closer.

  6. Gavin

    March 31, 2008 at 8:45 pm

    Flash Gordon is a tuff dude guys. He’s pitched through a torn labrum for the 2nd straight year. This is Pat Gillicks fault. Flash shouldnt have to come in and close. Very frustrating. Lets hope Lidge is back ASAP b/c Flash aint got it.

    I’m more disappointed in Myers and Madson. Myers was overthrowing all day and Madson has to be smarter than that against a free swinger like Milledge.

    Its just one day.

  7. Tony C.

    March 31, 2008 at 8:57 pm

    Relax boys, it’s the first game of the season.

    It is not like Gordon is going to be the Phillies closer for the entire season. I do recall getting a guy named Lidge this off season, I heard he has some pretty good stuff. He will be back on Saturday, and I think I can weather the storm until then.

    Every team will win 60 games and every team will lose 60 games. What matters is what you do in the other 42.

    Can’t wait for Wednesday night, lets go Hamels

  8. dan

    March 31, 2008 at 9:29 pm

    j. roll says we will win 40 of the other 42.

    i just feel so bad for players like rollins and utley. our hitters battled their way back into that ballgame, only to be let down again. it’s got to be so disappointing when your bullpen collapses like that. i wonder if the hitters ever say anything about their frustration with the fact that they perform so well and the pitchers don’t.

  9. jr

    March 31, 2008 at 10:17 pm

    “While I share your disdain towards ownership, they did get Brad Lidge. Granted, he’s had two knee surgeries already and he’s on the D.L., but he is a dominant closer.”

    Here’s the problem: After the bullpen continually lost games, they moved Myers. In the offseason they got Lidge and brought Myers back as a starter. BUT LIDGE IS INJURED! It doesn’t matter that he is signed if he can’t play! They are back to the pitching rotation that FAILED last year. It defies all logic.

  10. typhoon

    March 31, 2008 at 10:30 pm

    ^Lidge will be back Saturday.

  11. Sean P.

    March 31, 2008 at 10:51 pm

    As tough as this loss was the first seven games of last year were incredibly heart-wrenching and the Phils still made the playoffs.

    I know its easy to say in hindsight, but how about let a reliever go for more than one inning? Especially if there mowing guys down like Romero was. But really the game is tied in the ninth inning the game could have gone longer and Uncle Charlie is throwing out a new pitcher each inning.

  12. chris m

    March 31, 2008 at 11:36 pm

    blame it on gillick.he was too cheap for wagner and wanted gordan…another gillick s***y does he get any respect…. freddy garcia for our two best prospects!!!!!!!enough said

  13. Bill B.

    April 1, 2008 at 1:42 am

    Chill, Chris.

    I can’t blame Gillick for spurning Wagner, even though he’s been pretty good with the Mets. At the time, his contract was well above market value and it didn’t make sense to lock up up for 4 years at around $12-14 million per year. The Phillies offered him something like 3/$30M I believe.

    Gillick’s genius is in-season, unfortunately. Very few of his in-season moves have hurt the team in any meaningful way (for example, I wouldn’t say Jeff Conine hurt the Phillies even though he wasn’t good).

    The Freddy Garcia acquistion is good if you look at it in a vacuum. The Phillies, however, knew of his injury concerns and neglected to require a physical from him.

  14. PhilsPhunPhan

    April 1, 2008 at 2:15 am

    “As tough as this loss was the first seven games of last year were incredibly heart-wrenching and the Phils still made the playoffs.”

    You really can’t depend on all of the chips falling their way for half a month again.

    They need to set the bar, not aim for it in September.

  15. Lewisauce

    April 1, 2008 at 6:02 am

    Yes, we got Lidge. Yes, if he’s healthy, he’ll do well (I honestly believe that). But the ‘pen is still a mess. Our 10th guy is Condrey. Our 11th guy is Tim Lahey(?!?!?!?!?). Our 12th guy … doesn’t exist at the moment.

    And I get it. Lidge will be 12. When Rosario is healthy, he’ll replace either Lahey or Condrey.

    But the fact that we’re tap-dancing around with moves like that during games that matter is the problem. Management failed. They said they were focused on pitching during the off-season. There is no way to characterize the Eaton/Gordon/Condrey/Lahey/12th-man-to-be-named-later/closer-on-DL aspect of this pitching staff as anything but an abject failure.

    Look at this: supposing Flash had held up in the 9th, and the game went to 10 innings. Who would have pitched the 10th?

    **crickets, crickets**

  16. hoey

    April 1, 2008 at 6:41 am

    speaking of pitching. my jv team needs pitching. can one of the phillies bullpen denizens don a ghs uniform and pitch to 15 year old girls? they may be able to hold the opposition to 10 runs.

  17. Jason

    April 1, 2008 at 9:10 am

    I think Romero might have earned a shot at the closers role for the time being. Can it really get any worse?

  18. NYC PimP DaDDy

    April 1, 2008 at 9:25 am

    Mets Won. Philly Loses. Get used to it. Sookerz

  19. OZ

    April 1, 2008 at 9:30 am

    it’s well past Gillick’s fault or Manuel’s fault….ownership, ownership, ownership. same as Buddy Ryan’s talented Eagles teams – had all the defense one could hope for, Randall at QB and they did not put the pieces in place…..we will waste away Utley, Rollins & Howard for years.

    meanwhile, Bill Giles & Dave Montgomery, will shrug and pat their checkbooks. what i wouldn’t do for five minutes with those bozos.

  20. Gavin

    April 1, 2008 at 9:51 am

    Sure am glad we didnt shell out 4 mill for 1 year for Lohse…..not that he would have helped yesterday.

    Why did Madson come in the 6th inning? Shouldnt that have been Durbins spot?

  21. Mike

    April 1, 2008 at 10:26 am

    My opinion is that they were hoping to get 2 innings out of madson (the 6th and 7th). after he got lit up in the 6th though they obviously needed to pinch hit for him.

    I was at the game yesterday. What bothers me the most is how infrequently the Phils fans get rewarded for their optimism (seriously). The place, despite the crappy weather, was rocking, and ready to errupt. A win would have really jump started the fans and the team.

  22. NYC PimP DaDDy

    April 1, 2008 at 10:33 am

    Mets Win,

    Mets Win.

    Phillies Lose. HahAhahaha.

    i Enjoyed every minute of opening day, you phools. Told ya your 2nd best.

    Mets in first, phils in last

  23. Jim

    April 1, 2008 at 2:03 pm

    I know yesterday was only opening day, and I am not reading too much into it, but I want to be the first to put this out there. If Tom Gordon has a few more games like yesterday, he should be forced to change his nickname form Flash to Flush and his song should become the diarrhea song.

  24. Bill B.

    April 1, 2008 at 2:26 pm

    For those of you criticizing the Phillies for not getting the correct bullpen pieces, I ask you, what should the Phillies have done specifically?

    Should they have offered a nice package to the Twins before they signed Joe Nathan long-term?

    After trading for Lidge, should the Phillies have tried to acquire another closer-type that would push Gordon to the 7th inning? Who, specifically? Eric Gagne (who is getting $10 million)?

    The fact is that many teams, not just the Phillies, have bullpen issues. There’s not a lot out there. I was scratching my head when the Phillies passed on Aaron Fultz, but that’s one of very few players that would have both filled a glaring need in the bullpen and would have done so at an adequate level.

    The reason I ask you all what they should have done is that people often complain but rarely have a better alternative.

  25. Dan

    April 1, 2008 at 3:55 pm

    hey NYC idiot, the mets are in second. And its after one lousy game. Go screw yourself.

  26. typhoon

    April 1, 2008 at 4:04 pm

    Bill: I would have signed someone like David Riske or Ron Mahay and gotten a veteran like Latroy Hawkins, Octavio Dotel, Ron Villone, or Rudy Seanez (who the Phillies finally signed today!). Of course it is too late to get any of those guys now. THe bottom line is that there were plenty of guys out there would could have been signed at most for as much as Romero (or significantly less) who would have helped this bullpen. Now we are stuck with an old and injured Tom Gordon and Tim Lahey who has no major league experience. Not exactly a good way to start out the season. I would also cut Eaton and eat his salary and sign Claudio Vargas. There is no way Vargas can be worse than Eaton, And even if Vargas isn’t very good he could probably hold up until Benson or a minor league call-up is ready.

  27. Ashburn

    April 1, 2008 at 4:08 pm

    I’m so pissed about yesterday’s loss … what’s the use? We have a piecemeal rotation at best and our bullpen is horrific.

    And then … Santana … I want to vomit

  28. Geoff

    April 1, 2008 at 4:22 pm

    Kyle Lohse was grabbed for fairly cheap, he should be in this rotation over adam eaton and theres no excuse for that. theres nothing anybody can say about that or excuse you can give. Lohse can eat innings and provide decent starts. to let someone like the cardinals snap him up for cut-rate is totally unacceptable. Want to then risk waiting for Benson? Ok fine. I like Moyer but you cant keep sending a 45 year old man out there, Im sorry its just not going to be good enough at all. When the umps make him throw strikes hes out of the game by the third inning. I still think Myers is better as a closer because of his lunatic mindset. If Lidge turns out fine, then ok whatever, but why not have used those prospects on a play for a starter like Joe Blanton? The price would have been more than Bourn and a few throw-ins but it would be well-worth it to have a solid rotation, Id be OK with losing a good pitching prospect plus Bourn to make a move like that. Then you can send Hamels, Blanton, Kendrick, and Lohse out there. You make Eaton, benson, Durbin or anyone else battle it out for the 5th spot. Add some free agent arms in the bullpen then you have a decent setup. None of that is out of the question but they patently refused to do so. You have to spend the money and they wont do it until there is a serious shakeup in the front office/ownership realm.

  29. Bill B.

    April 1, 2008 at 4:41 pm

    Doesn’t Blanton have injury and/or conditioning concerns?

    I agree that letting Lohse go elsewhere was a huge mistake.

    Typhoon: Those guys were all on my radar during the off-season as well. Riske, in particular, was a guy I’d like to have seen Gillick sign.

    Per Cot’s Contracts, here’s what the relievers you mentioned signed for:

    David Riske: 08:$4M, 09:$4.25M, 10:$4.5M, 11:$4.75M club option ($0.25M buyout); $17M total
    Ron Mahay: 08:$4M, 09:$4M; $8M total
    Latroy Hawkins: 1 year/$3.75M (2008)
    Octavio Dotel: 08:$5M, 09:$6M; $11M total
    Ron Villone: 1 year/$0.6M (2008)

    Lidge: 1 year/$6.35M (2008) (also cost the Phillies Michael Bourn, Geoff Geary, and Mike Costanzo)

    Lidge is easily the most expensive of the bunch just for 2008. Depending on how you look at it, the fact that he’s a free agent at the end of the season either helps or hurts the Phillies. It can help in the sense that they’re not tied up to him, and it can hurt in the sense that the Phillies will have to go out and find another reliever anyway if he decides not to re-sign.

    It’s risky signing Riske to the contract the Brewers gave him since relief pitchers are so unreliable from year to year, but he’s been very consistent since 2003 so it’s probably worth the $17M total he’ll be getting in the next four years.

  30. Geoff

    April 1, 2008 at 5:18 pm

    Someone like Blanton, like good reliable number 2 on a good staff. They definitely dropped the ball but I think Gillick with make a splash at the deadline to leave his mark. Dunno what exactly it will be though

  31. typhoon

    April 2, 2008 at 11:39 pm

    The problem with Blanton is that he is a flyball pitcher and his career ERA is over 4. He is a good pitcher, but I don’t think he would be a great fit here. Better than Eaton of course, the prospects we would have to give up could end up being worse than the money we have to pay Eaton for what we are getting from him.

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