Trade Deadline Reset – Phillies Nation
Posts

Trade Deadline Reset

We’re a little more than one day from the non-waiver trade deadline, aka the most hyped in-season day in any sport. The Phillies, obviously in contention, are close to — if not, the top team in the midst of trade talks. To put everyone on the same page, I’m resetting everything we know, don’t know and kind of want to think we know.

July 17: Phillies trade Adrian Cardenas (IF), Josh Outman (P) and Matt Spencer (OF) to Oakland for Joe Blanton (SP)
A major deal, netting the Phillies a starting pitcher for a top-five prospect, a top-10 prospect and a low-level pseudo-prospect. As a Phillie, Blanton has been somewhat inconclusive (8 IP, 7 ER, 11 H, 4 BB, 2 K) but it currently doesn’t look promising. Cardenas, about two years from Major League impact, was seemingly blocked by the Phils middle infield stars. Outman, converted to a reliever after a rough patch as a Reading starter, was a fastball/changeup lefty close to becoming an MLB-level player. The jury, however, is still out on this trade.

Rumored: Phillies trade Shane Victorino (OF), Carlos Carrasco (P), Lou Marson (C), JA Happ (P) to Colorado for Matt Holliday (OF) and Brian Fuentes (P)
An absolute blockbuster that surfaced by the usually truthful Ken Rosenthal of FOXSports, the Phils would’ve gained a studly outfielder and solid back-end reliever for a big bounty. Supposedly the deal was nixed late. It would’ve cleaned out the Phillies farm system, with the No. 1 prospect, catcher-of-the-future and potential No. 3 starter heading west with the starting center fielder for at least another year. An absolute win-now move. Fuentes has since been taken off the trading block, and Holliday seems to be off, as well.

Rumored: Phillies trade Jason Donald (IF), Adrian Cardenas (IF) and JA Happ (P) to Cleveland for CC Sabathia (P)
According to Indians General Manager Mark Shapiro, the Phillies were the backup plan for Sabathia. Ultimately, he went to the Brewers, where he is currently 4-0 with an ERA under 2.00. This seemed to be the deal, but the Phils weren’t willing to part with Carrasco or Marson for Sabathia, who is under contract only until the end of the season.

Rumored: Phillies trade Jason Donald (IF) to Kansas City for Ron Mahay (P)
According to Jayson Stark, his sources (other general managers) said this deal was almost done. That was a little before noon Tuesday. In about an hour or so, Stark refuted his original claim and Rosenthal backed it up. Currently the Phillies are not the team in the lead for the left-hander.

Rumored: Phillies trade Lou Marson (C), Jason Donald (IF), JA Happ (P) and PTBNL to Toronto for Roy Halladay (P)
This came from Howard Eskin on 610 WIP Tuesday — not a great source, but it opened discussion. Supposedly the Phillies found out what it would take to get the all-world starter, and made an offer late today. Toronto rejected it, asking to put Fabio Castro in the deal. I’m not sure if Toronto wanted Castro or if Eskin misread Carlos Carrasco; either way, this deal would significantly reduce the farm system, though it would give the Phils maybe the best pitcher in baseball. I don’t expect anything to come out of this.

Players Inquired About

Starting Pitchers

AJ Burnett, Toronto (P)
Before the Blanton trade, Burnett seemed to be the Phils major focus. The Phils scouted him and talks evidently occurred, but Toronto wanted one of either Carrasco or Marson (really, Marson). The Phils said no.

Erik Bedard, Seattle (P)
Along with Burnett, Bedard was a top prize for the Phillies. Bedard seemed to be high on the trading block with the Mariners sinking fast, and the lefty even went on 950 AM in Philly to discuss his situation with the Mariners. But no rumored deal ever came to fruition, nor was there any indication the sides were talking. Once Blanton came through, this talk went by the wayside.

Bronson Arroyo, Cincinnati (P)
The Phillies “kicked the tires” at the righty who is having a poor year in Cincinnati.

Jarrod Washburn, Seattle (P)
Another tire-kicker, Washburn almost seemed set to go to the Yankees, but that has stalled.

Ben Sheets, Milwaukee (P)
The Phils scouted the All Star, but Milwaukee wasn’t looking to give up Sheets.

Greg Maddux, San Diego (P)
The Phils also scouted the Hall of Famer, but indications are he’d prefer either Los Angeles, Arizona, the Cubs or Atlanta.

Roy Oswalt, Houston (P)
The Phillies evidently scouted Oswalt, but the Astros don’t seem intent on giving up Oswalt, instead thinking they somehow have a shot this year.

Outfielders

Manny Ramirez, Boston (OF)
“Manny Wants Out of Boston Part XXIV” has somehow dropped the Phillies deep into the chapters. There should be truth to the rumor the Phils have asked about him. SI.com’s Jon Heyman is saying the Phils lead the charge to trade for the Hall of Fame hitter, but Heyman can’t be trusted as far as I can throw him (which isn’t far). Rumors have Ramirez coming here for Pat Burrell — a lateral move, and a dumb one from where I sit. Burrell is perfect for this team; Manny is the antithesis of Burrell.

Left-Handed Relief Pitchers

John Grabow, Pittsburgh (P)
The left-handed reliever seemed high on the Phillies’ list of left-handed relievers, but a recent injury has said to have scared the Phils off. Don’t be so sure, however.

Arthur Rhodes, Seattle (P)
Once a Phillie — and a bad one at that — Rhodes has found somewhat of a renaissance with the Mariners. Pat Gillick has a long work relationship with him, so it’s possible the Phils could strike an easy deal for the lefty.

George Sherrill, Baltimore (P)
The lefty is having a nice year with the Orioles, and the Phils have been said to be asking about him. Still, heavy thought is the O’s aren’t giving him up.

Other Possibilities

Starting Pitchers

Probably none at the non-waiver. Blanton was the move, and unless a ridiculous blockbuster with Toronto for Halladay occurs, the Phillies seem finished for now. Don’t count out a waiver move, however, especially if Brett Myers falters again or Blanton doesn’t pan out.

Outfielders

Something tells me the Phils won’t make an outfielder move unless it’s a big bat, a la Holliday or Ramirez. Even then the Phils would have to give up an outfielder (Victorino, Werth or Burrell) to get one. They haven’t been attached to Jason Bay, Adam Dunn or Raul Ibanez, and didn’t seem like runners in the Xavier Nady/Damaso Marte race. Look for a waiver claim, but then again, I could be shocked.

Just to add, the Phillies did show interest in Cleveland infielder/outfielder Casey Blake, but the Phils supposedly finished second in that sweepstakes.

Left-Handed Relief Pitcher

Not much else out there, as the Phils inquired about everyone worthy of inquisition. One other name: Jeremy Affeldt, who the Phils have asked about in previous seasons. Lefties are hitting slightly worse against him, but he has an ERA over 4.00 this season. If I had to point blindly at a target, I’d say the Phils overpay for Mahay or Grabow.

Other

A relief pitcher in general is a possibility, and Dan Wheeler of Tampa Bay has been mentioned. Can’t see the Rays giving him up, however. Look for a small pickup (maybe an infielder) after waivers. Gillick has a nice track record with the Phils in this arena (Jamie Moyer, Kyle Lohse).

Commentary

From almost day one, the Phillies said they were making Carlos Carrasco and Lou Marson untouchable. They’ve stood by that assertion (except for Holliday, if that’s true), and it makes sense. While it would’ve been nice to see the Phils go all-in to win now, their farm system isn’t as rich (allegedly) as other contenders’ (Yankees, Red Sox, Cubs). Truth is, you can’t deplete your entire farm system, especially when you’ve taken a couple years to rebuild it.

It was hard enough giving up Cardenas and Outman, and at this moment it seems like too much for Blanton. But they were strategic moves, better or worse, and don’t really harm the Phils’ long view. They tried for Sabathia but just couldn’t give it all up for a guy who they weren’t even sure they could re-sign. That’s the way it goes — when you empty your system in the past, you pay for it in the future.

The Phillies will almost definitely grab a left-handed reliever before the deadline passes. It would either cost them a Jason Donald (Mahay, Grabow) or a little more than cash (Rhodes). I’m hoping more cash than Donald, but then again, I don’t want Rhodes, I want Mahay. Don’t bet on a big deal for a Halladay or — forbid — Ramirez. I’m sorry, but Manny is bad news for the Phillies. They should — and probably have — stay away. Anyway, add a waiver claim or two and a later deal for a hitter and the Phils will be all set. In their eyes. Is it enough to go the distance? It’s possible.

Click to comment

0 Comments

  1. MA Phanatic

    July 30, 2008 at 7:24 am

    nicely done. I hadn’t heard the new Halladay rumor, and don’t really expect anything to come out of it. At this point, I’m not really expecting anything until August.

  2. Mike T.

    July 30, 2008 at 7:51 am

    The only move the Phils are making is for Arthur Rhodes (the first relief pitcher I remember disliking as a child – he stinks). The Phillies won’t do anything other than this cheap ass move. They won’t even get Mahay – they just won’t. All of those other rumors are just that, rumors. Not even close.

    Oh, and it doesn’t help that our whole minor league system is ranked so low (who knows how they even do this, I don’t buy any of it). Eevryone says, “Well the Phillies don’t have any top prospects to trade.” Bullshit – prospects are so overrated – who cares. All of that Phillies prospect talk even has douches like Tim McCarver and Joe Morgan saying, “oh yeah, the Phillies don’t have much to trade, I don’t think they’re in the market for any of these A-list type guys blah blah blah.” They don’t know shit. No one does. These players are 19 years old.

    Anyway, even if our prospects were deamed as “top prospects”, nothing would happen anyway.

    Oh, and one more thing – everyones hero, Carlos Carrasco, Monday night vs. Harrisburg:
    5.2 IP, 6 ER, 4 BB’s, 7 K’s

    There ya go. My dad was there, said the more the threw, the worse he got. The guy completely imploded in the 5th inning. So, that’s your number one prospect right there. If people want him so bad, get him out of here.

  3. Fred

    July 30, 2008 at 8:01 am

    Manny says he wants to come to the Phillies.

  4. Mike T.

    July 30, 2008 at 8:03 am

    Manny also says he’s worth 20 mil.

  5. Fred

    July 30, 2008 at 8:11 am

    He wants to be a FA next year plus Boston will pickup some of his salary this year. Additionally, the Phillies are not going to pay anyone 20 mil next year or in the future (and that includes Howard).

  6. MA Phanatic

    July 30, 2008 at 8:13 am

    Carrasco is 21 years old, so why don’t we give him some more time. I read he was dominant for the first 4 innings, before giving up a grand slam in the 5th. That’s why he’s in Double A, he’s still learning to pitch and develop. Prospects are valuable, but they are called prospects for a reason. And don’t say prospects are overrated, may I remind you that Jimmy Rollins, Pat the Bat, Chase Utley, Ryan Howard, and Cole Hamels are all home grown prospects. Last I checked, they aren’t what most call overrated.

    on a side note, Carlos Ruiz is also a prospect, so what do I know…

  7. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 8:17 am

    Carlos Ruiz was also a 2B prospect. He moved to catcher because he was blocked, obviously. He went from being a 2B to being a great defensive catcher. Just food for thought.

  8. Mike T.

    July 30, 2008 at 8:21 am

    MA Phanatic: Do you really want me to go down the list of baseballs top prospects from 2000-2005? Trust me, it favors my argument.

  9. Rick

    July 30, 2008 at 8:31 am

    Whatever happened to the Phillies interest in Alex Rios? What do you guys think about him?

    I haven’t really seen him play much other than when the Phillies play Toronto in interleague.

  10. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 8:31 am

    give me a break manny woiuld loosen this club house up i hope they do trade burrell for manny…better average better RBI producers…and honestly if manny comes to cbp he will have more HRs then burrell @ the end of the season…i love burrell but manny would give this lineup more of a scare then burrell does

  11. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 8:33 am

    you cant be a baseball fan and honestly believe not havin manny on this team makes the phillies better then the mets…

  12. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 8:34 am

    fuck the antics hes comes to our team for 2 months and will get us into the playoffs and who knows past then…manny also lights it up in the postseason

  13. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 8:34 am

    Eh, Burrell is having a career year. Manny is a future hall of famer. It’s a total wash to me. I’d rather have Burrell because he’s been my 2nd favorite Phillie since like 2002, up until now and he’s my favorite since Rollins is a fucking joke now.

  14. Mike T.

    July 30, 2008 at 8:37 am

    Rollins isn’t a joke – he’ll come around.

  15. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 8:39 am

    i don’t trust the phils but i am willing to guarentee we get manny for a lot of reason 1 most being charlie manuel loveeeeesssssss him….i would like a Lefty reliever but i believe our bullpen is fine the way it is…

    this offense has been struggling ever since june…manny changes that

  16. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 8:40 am

    this isnt a lateral move…manny changes enviorment and bang you got 40 bangers 100 pluss RBIS .310ish BA….how great would it be to watch him beat down on the metsssssss….

  17. Rick

    July 30, 2008 at 8:43 am

    I think everyone is making too big of a deal about J-Roll right now! He’ll be fine and he’s not going anywhere. He’s the spark for this team! He and Shane on base make Chase, Ryan, and Pat even more dangerous hitters because of the distraction.

    They said last night on MASN that the Phillies have only lost 8 games when Jimmy scores. That’s unreal!

  18. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 8:44 am

    I’ll take Manny if they shrink our outfield and Victorino does a line of coke everytime he goes out into the outfield so he gets the extra boost to run down balls in between those 2 guys. Burrell can not be involved in the trade, and they wouldn’t want Victorino, believe me.

  19. Mike T.

    July 30, 2008 at 8:44 am

    Would Manny be a great addition to this team? Yes.
    Would the swap of Burrell make sense? No.
    What can you make of these Manny rumors? Nothing.
    Is Manny going to be a Phillie? No.
    Ever? Never.

  20. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 8:45 am

    yeah jimmys fine take it eZ…

    I’d love that halliaday trade…i’d drive each prospect to the airport for that man plus hes signed through 2010…hamels halliaday wow

  21. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 8:45 am

    Yeah, well Jimmy needs to get on base to score. Also, Jimmy should take the team bus. He’s the team leader. Take the bus with the rest of the team you douche bag. He better come around. Stop doing commercials for ESPN and study pitchers.

  22. Mike T.

    July 30, 2008 at 8:45 am

    There, I just answered all of your questions. Let’s move forward.

  23. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 8:46 am

    explain why doesnt this manny trade make sense he no less a better defender then burrell so thats a wash./… hits 25 points higher then burrell….will hit more HRs when its all said in done then burrell @ CBP…better RBI producer then burrell…like how doesnt that make sense

  24. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 8:47 am

    I’d do the Halladay trade if they took out Marson and added Carrasco. Marson CANNOT be a part of any trade, unless you want to continue using a Ruiz/Coste platoon next year.

  25. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 8:48 am

    if i got bases loaded 2 outs i want manny up not burrell…plain and simple this trade makes sense

  26. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 8:49 am

    HALLIADAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!….i’d trade the farm for him…i here what you saying about marson but cmon a 1 2 with a hamels and halladay

  27. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 8:49 am

    Um, Burrell has less RBI’s because he bats in the 5 hole. Manny bats in the 4 hole. Look at Howard vs. Manny…catch my drift? I know Manny has men on base when he comes to bat.

  28. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 8:50 am

    ok…manny also had no ortiz with protection either so he was the biggest and only bat in the lineup…1 spot in the lineup doesnt make a difference…

  29. Mike T.

    July 30, 2008 at 8:51 am

    Tom: Money.

  30. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 8:53 am

    its 6 mil then burrell and plus its half a contract being paid…i know that teh problem but if you wanna win this year the best chance is to get manny…this offense is plain

  31. MA Phanatic

    July 30, 2008 at 8:53 am

    hey remember that time Pat Burrell had a full out no-trade clause and refused to waive it to go to Boston? Guess what Manny isn’t coming. Not only that, but Manny would destroy this clubhouse not loosen it. He divides players, with half loving him and half hating him…I don’t think he’d mesh well.

  32. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 8:54 am

    read the article MA phantic he said he would waive to go to boston or yanks

  33. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 8:54 am

    This stat is for close and late games.
    AB AVG HR RBI SO
    Player 1: 59 .237 5 14 15
    Player 2: 55 .308 6 18 17

    Which player would you rather have up with bases loaded bottom of the 9th down by 1?

  34. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 8:56 am

    Mike Lowell is on the Red Sox protecting Manny who is arguably the most clutch hitter on that team. Ortiz bats in front of him. So does Pedroia and Ellsbury.

  35. MA Phanatic

    July 30, 2008 at 8:57 am

    Tom i’m assuming you’re talking about the Heyman article? That article has been blown up by several baseball men who have talked to Philadelphia officials and Burrell won’t waive the clause.

  36. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 8:57 am

    ok but ortiz jusst came back…im not sdayin bostons lineup is not good…elsbury is not having a good year look @ his stats

  37. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 9:00 am

    Okay, well Pedroia is and Drew was batting in front of him before Ortiz who is having a monster year. You never answered my question…player 1 or 2?

  38. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 9:00 am

    Like Ramirez, Burrell has a no-trade clause. In the past, Burrell has indicated a willingness to waive his no-trade provision only to go to Boston or the Yankees.

  39. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 9:00 am

    what baseball people blew that story up…?

  40. MA Phanatic

    July 30, 2008 at 9:01 am

    yeah but that’s been in the past in this instance he won’t waive the clause.

  41. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 9:01 am

    Boston asked for Burrell straight up for J.D. Drew a few years ago. They wanted to move Manny and wanted Burrell as their back up plan. Burrell said no. Burrell would not leave the Phillies. Player 1 or Player 2?

  42. MA Phanatic

    July 30, 2008 at 9:02 am

    Here’s an article from the Phils official site, which includes a quick hit on Burrell’s clause

    http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20080730&content_id=3222982&vkey=news_phi&fext=.jsp&c_id=phi&partnerId=rss_phi

  43. MA Phanatic

    July 30, 2008 at 9:03 am

    Phil, what’s the contract situation for player 1 and 2, if you are doing a straight up comparison, that should be factored in

  44. Mike T.

    July 30, 2008 at 9:03 am

    Player 3, Chase Utley.

  45. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 9:06 am

    Would you like player 3’s statistics for close and late? He’s the worst of the 3.

  46. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 9:06 am

    You know…I oviously aint stupid i know it a long shot but I’m am tired of the wait till the prospects come up or anything…they need to make a move either for halliday holliday or manny…preferbly halliaday

  47. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 9:07 am

    Aw, if I told you the contract situation for player 1 and player 2 it would give it away.

  48. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 9:07 am

    If you want someone to come to your team learn to spell his name.

  49. Mike T.

    July 30, 2008 at 9:08 am

    No, because I don’t care.

  50. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 9:08 am

    Regardless of the situation, since Tom doesn’t want to answer…Burrell is player 2 Manny is player 1. I’d rather have Burrell up in the bottom of the 9th with bases loaded and down by 1. If it was October, I’d change my mind.

  51. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 9:08 am

    oh sorry phil you fuckin tool

  52. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 9:09 am

    You’re the tool. You want to trade our most clutch guy away.

  53. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 9:09 am

    god burrell over manny my god…the day i’d hear that haha…

  54. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 9:10 am

    There is no reason to trade for manny ramirez and its not going to happen, get it out of your heads. as soon as everyone hears his name they go apeshit and want him on our team. pay attention, look at his stats, it would be a BAD move to trade him for pat burrell. BAD. i dont want him anywher enear here. at this point in his career, you can go get jason bay or raul ibanez who have similar numbers for MUCH MUCH less. i dont know about bay, but i know ibanez is the most respected clubhouse player in major league baseball.

  55. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 9:10 am

    hahahahahahhahahahaha our most clutch guy i’d say howard…everytime some1 is on base he knocks them in

  56. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 9:12 am

    Would you like to see Howard’s stats in close and late games. Howard is great before the 7th inning, but he’s under the Mendoza line in situations like that. Burrell is great in the clubhouse and he’s been on the team for what, 9 seasons now?

  57. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 9:12 am

    player 2 … more RBIs in less at bats is the key there

    about the only good thing from Howard Eskin is that he has very good sources for his trade notes and stuff from every sport. The Blue Jays have no specific reason to trade Roy Halladay or to keep thim either.. as they are more than a few pieces away from a World Series. IF they trade him, you can be sure it will be to an NL team though. and I believe that C and SS are the positions they have been looking to phill

  58. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 9:13 am

    manny ramirez is 36 and his knees are bad. he doesnt care about his team or his teammates at all and wont play defense and wont try hard.

    id rather have pat burrell, who loves philadelphia and wants to stay here even though the team is too cheap to even give him an offer thats not insulting

  59. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 9:14 am

    Yeah, I’m with you Geoff. I bet if the Yankees offered him 5 years $60 million and we offered him 5 years $50 million he’d stay in Philly and take the home town paycut, but that’s all speculation.

  60. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 9:14 am

    i’d trade marson donald and supposely castro for him in a second…thats my first choice he is arguably the best pitcher in baseball and it wouldnt be a rent situation since he is signed for 2 more years

  61. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 9:15 am

    Oh, Burrell not the most clutch guy on the team? By the way, he is 2nd to only Derek Lee for game winning hits this season. Lee has 12 Burrell has 11. That’s in all of major league baseball too. FYI

  62. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 9:15 am

    First of all… the Phillies were never trading Pat Burrell for Manny Ramirez… don’t know where that came from, or why they keep getting compared to one another.

    Obviously you would rather have Manny Ramirez batting for you at any time over Pat Burrell…. Manny is a Hall-of-Famer… Burrelll should have made the All-Star team, once….

    You could get Manny for peanuts because they want to ditch his contract… and they know there isn’t a great demand for him anywhere. We aren’t getting him, so why are we worrying about this anyway??

  63. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 9:17 am

    If they trade Manny they’re going to want a comparable bat to replace him. They’ll want Werth. They’ll get Werth and platoon him with Ellsbury in left field and make Coco the everyday CF probably.

  64. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 9:18 am

    Do you guys have any idea how SLOW Pat Burrell is going to be in 5 years… he’s a DH waiting to happen.

    guys… take 10 deep breaths and think about who you would rather have hitting for you at any time in any game.. and if you really would rather have Pat Burrell at the plate than Manny Ramirez.. you should not be allowed to post on this site anymore

  65. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 9:19 am

    i think it would make us a better offensive team but whatever i guess we will find out by tomorrow what the phils do…prolly nothin again

  66. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 9:20 am

    DON M..thank you everyone here is in love with burrell because hes been a phillie forever give me a break burrel over manny haha

  67. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 9:21 am

    Ellsbury is a top-10 prospect in all of baseball… he’s not platooning with anyone if Ramirez leaves.

    They can’t ask for anything good in return because teams have to take his $20 M salary and thats doing enough in return..

    Has anyone heard what they are/were asking for him? If they ask for more than crap, then they won’t be able to trade him……

    WHY ARE WE STILL TALKING ABOUT THIS ANYWAY… HE’S NOT GETTING TRADED, AND IF HE DOES, ITS NOT TO THE PHILLIES

  68. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 9:23 am

    if you forced me to get ramirez, which i would still resist, i would honeslty only give up a shitty, horrible prospect and package him with geoff jenkins and say: you want to dump salary? well so do we, enjoy…

  69. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 9:23 am

    Burrell is having a nice year…not a hall-of-fame year…. and he’s FAR from a hall-of-fame player… under his current contract he has some pretty good years, and some terrible years.

    Im thinking the Phillies offer him $30 M over 3 years… and Im thinking that an AL team gives him closer to $50 over 5 years. THAT will be his decision, both years and dollars, not just taking less money to stay in Philly.. we won’t have a spot for him since he’ll just slow down more and more in the coming seasons

  70. MA Phanatic

    July 30, 2008 at 9:24 am

    Tom just made a great point, we all know that Philly won’t make any sort of splash by tomorrow at 4 pm

  71. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 9:25 am

    I’d rather have Burrell up at anytime during the regular season. I would be ridiculously pissed about the trade, until October came. Boston already said they’d pay the $7 million owed to Manny. They’re paying him to go away, they just want a bat to replace him. Someone pointed out earlier, Ellsbury’s not having a spectacular season as Tom pointed out earlier.

  72. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 9:25 am

    THAT would be a smart move… and that would give the Sox a veteran bat off the bench..

    Maybe the smartest move I’ve ever heard you mention Geoff.. nice job!

  73. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 9:26 am

    Burrell could play LF for 5 more years, I guarantee it. Gary fucking Sheffield still plays LF sometimes.

  74. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 9:27 am

    hahahaha YES! Give them Jenkins for Ramirez. That would rule.

  75. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 9:28 am

    Everyone still disagree with me that the CUBS are the best team in the National League??

    We haven’t had that discussion in a few weeks…. I still think they are the hands down favorite in the NL..

    and its going to be a battle in the AL. I think the Angels have now won 5 in a row over the Red Sox

  76. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 9:28 am

    The problem is they failed to prepare for this. We have no idea if greg golson is ready to replace him in left field. thats a total shot in the dark. so maybe you have to pony up and give burrell one or two more years, now i know he wont like that, but thats all im asking. keep him aroun duntil you know someone can step in there and get it done. if you have to givre him 17mm this year and 19mm next year then fine. who cares. just make sure that if he does leave, he has a CAPABLE replacement at the palte and in the field.

    they let aaron rowand leave without a capable offensive replcaement. shane is a defensive improvement over rowand, but noone filled his offensive/ leadership void.

    so IF he does walk, you better damn well replace that production.

  77. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 9:29 am

    so if your a pitcher phil and you are facing the phils you are more scared to face burrell then many?

  78. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 9:30 am

    the rich get richer…does anyone else think the angels didnt give up much at all for tex?

  79. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 9:32 am

    There’s a reason Howard’s IBB’s are down by a lot this year, and it’s not just because he’s easy to strike out. They are terrified to pitch to Burrell. He’s having a ridiculous year, especiallyo n the road. His OPS on the road is almost 1300.

  80. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 9:33 am

    kotchman is having his best year yet but thats it?? one solid player under team control and a pitchin gprospect i never heard of.

  81. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 9:33 am

    look at Victorino/Rowand offensive number comparison that I posted yesterday…

    If they are missing Rowand at all.. its in the locker room… and that is the biggest cop-out in all of sports is that you need locker room leaders and stuff. Just play baseball..

    PHIL,

    read what you just said… “I’d rather have Burrell up at anytime during the regular season.”

    That is the most ridiculous statement I’ve heard in a long-long time

  82. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 9:34 am

    oh, and that heyman dude from SI, is COMPLETE trash. im pretty sure hes ALWAYS wrong

  83. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 9:34 am

    ok i am just asking…if your a pitcher you are honestly saying that you would be scared more for burrell then manny?

  84. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 9:35 am

    phils got a serious man crush on burrell…burrell is batting high .270s most of the year …. put manny in CBP he leads the league in HRS

  85. MA Phanatic

    July 30, 2008 at 9:36 am

    yeah I thought the Braves could have gotten more from Teix but I’m glad they only got what they did it helps out the Phils. I think the Angels are the team to beat, and the Cubs the team to beat in the NL.

    An interesting thought here is that the NL east is going to be the same situation as last year, and that is that a team is going to have to win the division to get in. The Brew Crew are tearing it up, (before the cubbies came to town) and I think it’s pretty safe to assume those two get in either way. I think the Phillies need to win the NL East to get in to the dance.

  86. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 9:36 am

    and why do you think they went into a slump for 6 weeks? 6 WEEKS. the only reason they might be out of it now is because theyre playing the braves and the nationals.

    all that talent, lost, not caring, not playing well, charlie trying everything he knows, whats missing there is…….LEADERSHIP and PROFESSIONALISM.

  87. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 9:36 am

    From Jayson Stark.. pretty much killing the notion some guys had of giving them Bastardo and some junk prospects for Jason Bay

    “Bay: The Pirates are asking for four players back — two sure-thing young players, one good prospect and a fourth prospect with upside. ”

    and then the pitchers they had/have:

    “Marte: The Pirates seem confident he’ll be a Type A free agent, so they’re telling teams they need to do better than the first-round pick and sandwich pick they’d get if he walks.

    Grabow: Because Grabow can’t be a free agent until after next season, the Pirates are looking for a similar package on him as they’re asking on Marte.”

  88. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 9:37 am

    i like bay but he does K a lot

  89. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 9:37 am

    The Braves totally got ripped off. I would have told them I wanted Ervin Santana or the deal is off.

  90. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 9:39 am

    where is this board @….

    Batter

    or

    pitcher

    for trade deadline?

  91. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 9:39 am

    Leadership doesn’t hit the ball and score runs in 3-1 game in the late innings..

    Professionalism doesn’t help pitchers throw strikes or not allow Home Runs..

    Leadership maybe has a talk with Jimmy Rollins, or does exactly what Jamie Moyer did which was go through the press and say that all players need to be responsible and the owe it the team, etc…

  92. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 9:40 am

    Pat Burrell is showing professionalism, Manny isn’t.

  93. MA Phanatic

    July 30, 2008 at 9:40 am

    the asking price has skyrocketed badly for pitchers on the past few years, and it’s killing the MLB Trade Deadline. Hardly anyone moves anymore, and forget big names.

  94. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 9:41 am

    exactly. ill even say: kendry morales, ervin santana, filler prospects with a decent one in there somewhere.

    the angels have the best shot at resigning tex now because theyre LOADED with money. will they ? well, their closer is going to set the single season saves record in all likelihood so well see…that might be the only guy in all of baseball right now who id consider letting close a game for us in palce of lidge. keyword: consider.

  95. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 9:42 am

    By the way Don M, I posted the the regular season stats of Manny and Pat the Bat for close and late games. Pat the Bat is obviously beating Manny. I am not by any means saying I don’t want Manny in the Phillies line up, I am just saying I do not want to give up Burrell to do it.

  96. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 9:43 am

    every year we specualte and nothing happens so i am going to put it to rest and act like a WIP host…NOTHING IS GONG TO HAPPEN AGAIN…sucks but again we are cheap and not willing to pay money for lose propects with the HYPE of being good for already proven major league talent

  97. Mike T.

    July 30, 2008 at 9:44 am

    Geoff and Don M to the rescue, finally. Where the hell were you guys when I was trying to maneuver through these idiots?

  98. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 9:45 am

    dont get me wrong don m, they need more talent in all facets of the game, but whats the explanation of pretty much the whole team being lost for 6 weeks? thats not just a slump, that doesnt just happen. thats INEXCUSEABLE….6 FREAKIN WEEKS.

  99. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 9:45 am

    PITCHER… we have a better chance of out-scoring a team already then we do of out-pitching them.

  100. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 9:46 am

    Mike T. I totally agree with you about the swapping of Burrell for Manny, why am I not part of the non-idiot movement?

  101. Tom

    July 30, 2008 at 9:46 am

    hahaa if the phils get arthhur rhodes hahahah we all know its gonna happen haha

  102. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 9:47 am

    im calling for bay, and if they got mahay i guess i wouldnt be upset given what we need.

    i know theyre going to get arthur rhodes mike, i just dont want to accept it yet, and its going to piss me off. just to personally piss us off, theyll go and give up jason donald for arthur rhodes.

  103. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 9:48 am

    I don’t think the Phils will get Rhodes. They already “solved” the lefty in the pen issue. It was probably the best way to solve it in all honesty. Now he’s up in the bigs, and if Myers crumbles then you can stop using him in the pen and prepare him for a start.

  104. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 9:49 am

    AGAIN… nobody said you had to give up Burrell to do it… from everything i’ve seen, they are simply trying to rid themselves of him because he hates everything about the RedSox anymore…

    Braves made a smart decision… Tex was leaving for Free Agency without a doubt.. and they were going to lose him. They got a starting 1b and pitcher with some upside for a player they were going to lose and not make the playoffs either way..

  105. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 9:49 am

    everyone hears manny and goes into a frenzy, IDIOTS. id rather have raul ibanez or jason bay and no question id rather have burrell..LOOK AT THE STATS. mannys hitting .300 and thats his only advantage over those three

  106. Phil

    July 30, 2008 at 9:49 am

    According to Dejan Kovacevic of the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette, the Pirates are deep into talks with the Rays and other teams about left fielder Jason Bay. However, no “truly elite prospect” has been offered yet, and the chances are better than 50-50 that Bay stays. And who would move to right field for the Rays – Bay or Carl Crawford? The Braves are considered out of the mix.

    Shortstop Jack Wilson seems likely to stay, while reliever John Grabow will probably be dealt.

  107. Mike T.

    July 30, 2008 at 9:49 am

    Yeah, I was in a bad mood during that 7:51 post.

  108. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 9:50 am

    I do, however, like having happ up here and keeping him around juuuust in case. nicely noted phil. a constant reminder staring brett in the face every start…dont screw up.

  109. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 9:53 am

    alert alert: im am now willing to give up carlos carrasco for the right player.

  110. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 9:53 am

    leaving lou marson the lone untouchable…becuase i KNOW for sure he will be on this team next year at the start of the season…

  111. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 9:54 am

    JA HAPP … lefties were only 1-for-12 against him in his two starts.. Phillies might just use him as the Lefty we’re looking for.. a strikeout guy who lefties can’t hit..

    I think the MAHAY trade is a good one, because Donald wasn’t close to coming up.. I guess that trade is dead in the water now though?

  112. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 9:55 am

    don..apparently others a leading for mahay. donals wasnt enough because his price is higher than that! thats crazy

  113. Pete

    July 30, 2008 at 10:00 am

    GET ROY HALLADAY. Marson, Carrasco, Happ, Donald – that’s less than what was given up for Haren, and Halladay is better than Haren. At the same time, Toronto ought to take that deal. They get an MLB-ready pitcher, an almost-ready potential stud catcher, a potential 2/3 starter, and the young SS they desperately need.

    IF Halladay really wants out of Toronto to play for a contender, this trade works all around. And anyone who says Marson is too much to give up for Roy freakin Halladay is insane. The guy is arguably the best pitcher in baseball and clearly in the top 3. He’s locked up through 2010 well below market value. Yeah, Ruiz is no good on offense, but WHO CARES? We have absolutely no idea what Marson can do in terms of managing the pitching staff, and no clue whether he can hit MLB pitching. There is NO ONE who should be off the table when it comes to Halladay. Trade the entire roster of the Reading Phillies if that’s what it takes.

  114. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 10:03 am

    Yea, like yesterday when I told you how much it costs to get a solid reliever…

    sometimes the BEST NAME isn’t the best guy.. and I still think that if we get MAHAY its a good move for the club.

    I heard BAY to the RAYS as well… and they are still looking at Fuentes, but I think the Rockies keep him for two reasons: They aren’t far off from taking the NL WEST which is a weak division, and they want the draft picks he gets them when he leaves.

    I would give up Carrasco in a Halladay trade, but I wouldn’t give him up for anything other than a STUD starting pitcher.. since Carrasco has the potential to be a top of the rotation guy, and we can all see how hard they are to get

  115. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 10:06 am

    Carlos Carrasco, Jason Donald, Greg Golson, antonio bastardo, and a filler prospect for Roy Halladay

    I cant understand why that package isnt enough give or take. the phillies didnt offer lou marson and ja happ, guaranteed. eskin is clueless..

    that package i just mentioned is better than the sabthia package because they wouldnt include carrasco in the sabathia package.

    toronto gets a starter, the shortstop they need, and an outfielder.

  116. Richie Allen

    July 30, 2008 at 10:06 am

    Just a thought on prospects…what if the phillies would have traded Utley , Howard,Rollins,Burrell,Hammels,when they were on the verge of coming up…..sometimes you have to keep the farm guys and give them a chance…
    BUT not this time…..
    TO PHILLIES:TRADE THE PROSPECTS,get help now,wE WERE NOT IN A PENNANT RACE THEN AS WE ARE NOW.
    Are we to wait ANOTHER 20 years for a chance at the world series?

  117. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 10:07 am

    I agree, but im still not including marson, why? because elite everyday catchers, even potential ones, are HARDER to find that elite starting pitching.

  118. Lewisauce

    July 30, 2008 at 10:08 am

    Can we please can it with the Manny shit?

  119. Greg B

    July 30, 2008 at 10:09 am

    Manny is a better hitter than Pat. I don’t care what the stats say. I know it. Uncle Chuck would slide him right in between Utley and Howard. Making our lineup better in late innings. Problem is still that we don’t have any bats after Howard. Feliz, Ruiz, and principle offender Suck Jenkins simply aren’t good. Dobbs and Coste provide relief, but are there any bats that can produce some average out there? So Taguchi, God Bless his heart for that 2B against the Mets, can’t hit a lick and really needs to go. Can we replace Jenkins with Snelling? or anyone? All I get is Ks and no clutch hits out of this guy. I’ll concede that from a defensive 3rd baseman who’s been fighting a bad back, and my catcher, but RF?!!! We need some production out of Jenkins and Taguchi’s roster spots.

  120. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 10:10 am

    Um, Id rather have howard as the cleanup hitter THIS season.

  121. Pete

    July 30, 2008 at 10:11 am

    And if Eskin is right (a long shot, I know, but he did break the Elton Brand and Kareem Rush signings before anyone else), and Fabio Castro held up a trade for Halladay, the entire front office should be fired and exiled from Philadelphia.

  122. Pete

    July 30, 2008 at 10:15 am

    Geoff – Golson has almost zero value for the Jays as their outfield is set for the next 4-5 years with guys they already have. What Gillick should do is hand the Jays a list of players and tell them to pick 4. No one should be off the table. Last year, everyone was talking up Jaramillo, now he might as well be a .200 hitter in low-A ball for as much as anyone mentions him.

    Marson looks like he will be good, no doubt, but you cannot let love for your AA catcher prevent you from getting Halladay for (at least) two and a half years. This team has about a 3-year window. We’d have Halladay for that entire time. I cannot imagine that we have a better shot at a WS with Marson in ’09 or ’10 than with Halladay

  123. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 10:16 am

    They just report what they hear… like the report out of AAA two weeks that RIGHT-HANDED pitching prospect JA HAPP struck out 12…

    They can only report what they hear or read… and im sure he speculated that they must have meant Carlos Carrasco..

    As big a jerk as Howard Eskin is…. he REALLY knows his stuff when it comes to trade rumors and stuff. and he always has reliable info… he was also the first one to report that the Phillies made an offer for Matt Holliday, but that it wasn’t going to get done….. 5 days later other people finally started to realize that it wasn’t going to happen

  124. Richie Allen

    July 30, 2008 at 10:19 am

    I agree with Lewis….,please get off the Manny subject ..he is not coming to Philly..1)cost 2)his attitude…..He would wreck whatever chemistry we have now,believe me.
    His first tirade would have you Manny lovers running for the hills.

  125. Fred

    July 30, 2008 at 10:22 am

    ‘Idiots’ ? Anyone with a differing opinion concerning our beloved Burrell is labeled an idiot. At least we don’t link our name to an advertisement to some window replacement website. If one were so knowledgeable, one’s link would be to his current employment with MLB.

    As far as our untouchable prospects, i.e. Marson, Donald, Carrasco, why haven’t they made it past AA ball? Donald is an utility infielder at best, Marson is already 22 and still at Reading, and Carrasco only projects to a 3 starter. Sure the farm has produced Utley, Howard, and Rollins but that’s out of how many thousands of players that have gone through the system.

    If the goal is to win this year then go get Manny.

  126. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 10:28 am

    howard eskin personally hates the front office, hes not a good source because he has conflicts of interest. he WORKS for the eagles. they actually pay him bonuses and give him gifts and stuff.

  127. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 10:29 am

    fred..its 2008: AA ball is where all the top prospects are for every team. AAA is a wastefland of ol djunkballers and washed up people. they leave some guys in AAA because its easier to call them up and send them down.

  128. Fred

    July 30, 2008 at 10:34 am

    Maybe for teams like the Phillies – good teams like the BoSox they best prospects are in AAA. And explain why it’s easier to get someone to Philly from Allentown than it is from Reading.

  129. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 10:36 am

    I can’t imagine that Howard Eskin hates the Phillies front-office more than you, Geoff..

    But anyway, how does one’s opinions of the front office have ANYTHING to do with reporting trade rumors or not.?

    AA is usually the spot for TOP-PROSPECTS… some guys, like Jay Bruce, Cameron Maybin, and I think Ellsbury etc were at AAA, but it often depends on which AAA-league you are in. the EASTERN LEAGUE of AA is among the most talented minor-league divisions in all of baseball… Also, teams like guys in AA because the travel is often not as grueling as AAA, where the bus rides are longer since the teams are most spread out

  130. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 10:39 am

    Eskins like Rush Limbaugh, except for sports.

  131. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 10:39 am

    like, a guy tahts totally owned and is a complete shill for someone.

  132. Griffin

    July 30, 2008 at 10:42 am

    hey, did anyone hear about the rumor of Manny Ramirez to the Phillies?

    just kidding. Seriously though, why would the Blue jays trade Halladay when he’s under team control for 2 more years at a good salary? If they wanted to do this, there are teams with a lot better prospects than the Phillies. Don’t hold your breath on that one.

  133. Mike T.

    July 30, 2008 at 10:42 am

    Fred: You. Are. Wrong. AA ball holds the best minor league players – I’m not too sure why you believe otherwise. Before I go further, please tell me why you think AAA ball is better, because it’s not.

  134. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 10:49 am

    Some teams send their better players to AAA…it all depends on what league it is… AA – EASTERN LEAGUE is usually a top-level of talent…. definitely better then the AAA – INTERNATIONAL LEAGUE which is often full of guys that hit their ceilings, or they are trying to make it BACK to the majors..

    Its a tough arguement to have, and not worth having, since none of us follow enough minor league ball besides the Phillies system anyway.. let it go yo’s

  135. Fred

    July 30, 2008 at 10:50 am

    Pawtucket is in the same league as the Iron Pigs. Also the BoSox AA team – Portland – is in the Eastern League. So if the Red Sox have their TOP PROSPECTS in AAA why wouldn’t the Phils? Your arguments about travel and quality don’t hold water.

  136. rk

    July 30, 2008 at 10:51 am

    I saw Fabio Castro last night in Harrisburg give up 5 runs in 2 innings (4 in the 1st), two home runs to the same lefty so if the Phils dont want to part with him they are idiots, of course Carasco did not look that great the night before.

    Facing Zack Segovia by the way.

  137. Mike T.

    July 30, 2008 at 10:52 am

    Harrisburg represent.

  138. Fred

    July 30, 2008 at 10:56 am

    Baseball America’s Top 10 prospects for 2008. Seven are/were in AAA; Two were/are in AA.

  139. Fred

    July 30, 2008 at 10:58 am

    Sorry… that’s seven are/were in AAA; three are/were in AA.

  140. Fred

    July 30, 2008 at 10:59 am

    All three AA players were in the Southern League.

  141. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 11:03 am

    Mike T…you might have to readoff that prospect like from 2000-2006 for fred here. after work, though.

  142. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 11:06 am

    every GM in baseball says that travel in AA is less than in AAA…

    Marson, Carrasco, Donald, Golson are obviously better than any AAA players…

    Most AA teams are within closer range of each other than AAA teams. I have no reason to make this up I was simply stating why some teams keep their guys in AA.

    Somebody should see about checking the top-100 and how many are in AA vs. AAA just to see what teams are really doing.

  143. Fred

    July 30, 2008 at 11:13 am

    Still can’t see the travel issue. It’s not a long trip from Reading to Portland, Maine? The talent issue could be true but didn’t Howard, Utley, Rollins and Hammels all come from AAA?

  144. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 11:22 am

  145. Mike T.

    July 30, 2008 at 11:27 am

    Geoff, I’ll try to put something together during the game tonight.

  146. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 11:32 am

    werd.

  147. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 11:34 am

    I see tons of teams making aggressive plays today and the Phillies are NOT one of them. They may try and continue the manny ramirez fraud up until the deadline, get arthur rhodes, and act like “well we tried,” bullshit. you didnt try. go try.

    i can only hope that he phillies are working on a “secret” trade that they dont want us to know about yet.

    because honestly, i havent seen anything promising today AT ALL.

  148. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 11:37 am

    You only keep your proepscts, sans marson, if youre a GOOD talent evaluator and you KNOW theyre a sure thing. otherwise, you trade them for peces IF AND ONLY IF youre in a win now mode, which we are or should be. i know lou marson is a sure thing, so he cant be traded.
    i was confident in carrasco but not anymore really, and i cant say anyone else is a sure thing, except maybe donald.

    the phllies have the worst minor league talent avaluation ive ever seen AND the talent they do have they dont spend money on to lock up or bring in.

    you almost have to spend as much or more money on your farm system as a whole than you do your big league roster. you can get away with moneyball in the bigs if you have an elite farm system.

  149. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 11:38 am

    There are all kinds of articles out there about AA vs. AAA prospects… usually mentioning that a guy reaches his skill-prime and starts to level out at about age 26.

    The avg age for AA is like 25, the avg age for AAA is like 28… so AA is usually full of guys with more POTENTIAL than AAA.. but a good way to judge talent is by playing against more experienced players..

    I’ve read in numerous books before the minor league players can throw just as hard, and hit the ball just as far as major league players, the only difference is that Major league players do it more consistently (THATs what she said..)

    So if you want to say that the AAA-level has more “consistent” level of play than AA, I would probably agree… but there is more raw-talent and potential at the AA-level.

    Books I’ve read about this stuff include, MONEYBALL, 3 NIGHTS IN AUGUST, and PLANET OF THE UMPS… all pretty easy reads for a baseball fan…

    And i’m going to attempt to contact Rick Reilly about a HOT-STOVE book…anyone thats ever read his golf stuff knows how amusing and insightful he can be at the same time.

  150. Gary B

    July 30, 2008 at 11:39 am

    Just saw this on MLB trade Rumors…

    Maddux Won’t Go To Philly
    By Tim Dierkes [July 30 at 10:22am CST]
    According to Scott Miller of CBSSports.com, the Phillies had the Padres ask Greg Maddux if he would accept a trade there. Maddux told Padres GM Kevin Towers he would not. Towers continues to be limited to the West Coast as he tries to move Maddux’s remaining $3.3MM salary.

    Why the hell would we want an over the hill righty who throw’s 80 MPH, we already have one…

  151. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 11:40 am

    Maddux would get lit up at CBP because he has the last few times here.

  152. Jeff

    July 30, 2008 at 11:44 am

    phillies outfielders are hitting fine right now. victorino is on fire, burrell is doing what he’s been doing all year, and werth is doing a decent job when he’s playing (not the biggest fan of jenkins).

    phils offensive struggles right now center around rollins and utley struggling. phils have 3 catalysts: rollins, victorino, utley. rollins looks like he may be coming out of the slump, but utley doesn’t. he hit a hr last night but thats his first since before the all star break. rumor has it he may have an injury, i’d sit him for a week…or at least against the washington nationals. utley doesn’t get better we’re in trouble

  153. Mike T.

    July 30, 2008 at 11:45 am

    Haha, Don.

  154. Gary B

    July 30, 2008 at 11:45 am

    I dont understand why they were even looking at him?

  155. Mike T.

    July 30, 2008 at 11:45 am

    I like that Office reference.

  156. Georgie

    July 30, 2008 at 11:47 am

    Hey, Geoff, just checked in first time since Sunday PM, saw your comment on Amaro, and I couldn’t agree more. I saw him on DNL Monday, he is so full of crap, I’ve thought that for years. He seems to have a bug up his ass regarding current salaries, like he feels he really got screwed when he was playing. If he is the next Philllies’ GM, we’ll be waiting another 28 years for a championship! Very few people have this effect on me, but every time I see him, I want to reach thru the screen and slap him silly. Ed Wade actually made me feel like that too. And Karl Rove. And Dick Cheney, but now I’m digressing.

  157. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 11:53 am

    I wholly agree. Especially about Karl Rove (did you know he got indicted and fled the country? seriously, he did. he refused to show up to hearings and they subopened him, then indicted him, then he fled. but theres a mainstream media blackout out on it which means they wont talk about it on the 6:00 news), and Dick Cheney (did you know Dennis Kucinich is leading a growing movement to impeach bush and cheney and they had a hearing about it friday, but it wont go farther than that).

    aaaaanyways, amaro will be the worst GM in professional sports if hes hired, and im dead serious about that. they need someone who knows what theyre doing, like a beane disciple or something like thjat

  158. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 11:54 am

    Geoff,

    This has Lou Marson as the #7 catching prospect, #125 overall…
    http://www.scoutingbook.com/prospects/c

    (Carrasco has moved up to #9 overall here)

    Marson was not in Sports Illustrated top-100 going into this season.

    Marson was not in the SportsCity top-100 going into this season.

    I still want to know how you KNOW he’s going to be so awesome at the big league level…

  159. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 11:56 am

    Just a hunch type of feeling, you look at him playing and you look at the way he calls a game and you look at the numbers and you can tell.

    besides, marson emerged this season into the top frey. thats why EVERY rumored major move the phillies make for a top bat or a top arm has had marson in the discussion.

  160. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 11:56 am

    whos, mlbtr…..

    says that the rays are scouting jayson werth and that hed be avaiolable in the right deal….interesting. but for what?

  161. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 11:59 am

    i mean, interesting.

  162. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 12:03 pm

    well then say you THINK he’s going to be a good player…. 3 weeks ago you were telling us that Carrasco reminds you of Josh Beckett… now you want to trade him

    You know we need help in the bullpen and that Donald has no position to play in Philly, but you got pissed about them possibly trading him..

    and now you’re telling us that you just have gut-feeling that Marson is going to be awesome, but the guys that are paid to scout players full-time don’t have him ranked in the top-100 in baseball…

  163. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 12:05 pm

    MLBTR http://www.mlbtraderumors.com

    Rays scouting Jayson Werth..

    doesn’t say what the Phillies are looking for in return though.. If they trade Werth they definitely would need to re-sign Burrell

  164. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 12:06 pm

    because marson emerged THIS year. hell be their top prospect next year he he isnt already in the majors, which he will be in spring training and to start the season.

    yeah his stuff reminds me of becketts in a very raw form. BUT he seems to be a little bit of a headcase, and we have enough of those. if someone can fix him then hell be great.

    but guess what, who does he remind you of even MORE than beckett? gavin floyd. that means someone elses farm, you know, with GOOD coaches at the minor league level, will fix him and hell be awesome.

    face it, our scouts BLOW. how often do they trade the wrong prospect or keep the wrong guy, or trade for someone who comes here and sucks, or trade for someone who is ALREADY injured, etc.?

  165. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 12:08 pm

    im ok with trading werth for a value in return. i want one of their arms. they have a plethora of starting and bullpen arms. what about jayson werth for andy sonnanstine or jayson werth for edwin jackson and a position player prospect or some kind of deal like that?

  166. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 12:08 pm

    theyd have to go out and find another OF though this season.

  167. Pete

    July 30, 2008 at 12:14 pm

    If they trade Werth they have to trade for Manny (or Bay, or Holliday, but at this point they’re not involved with those two from anything I’ve seen). The OF defense will take a nose-dive, but the offense will be that much better. No way can they afford to have Jenkins start.

  168. NEPA

    July 30, 2008 at 12:17 pm

    Yea, if we trade Werth for a pitcher then our outfield becomes extremely shaky.

  169. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 12:21 pm

    theyd have to go get another OF to make up for it. but anything that improves the pitching cant be too bad, if they do it for pitching.

  170. Mike

    July 30, 2008 at 12:21 pm

    I would rather have a shaky outfield then shaky pitching.

  171. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 12:22 pm

    This is how amazing he’s doing at AA-Reading

    In 92 games… .319 Batting Average and .434 on-base-percentage are both VERY GOOD!!

    He’s only got 5 HR, and 46 RBIs… He’s grounded into 10 double-plays and made 9 errors.

    NOT VERY GOOD!!

    meanwhile what everyone has been knocking Ruiz the most for was his Grounding into Double-Plays… he’s done that 11 times, only once more than Marson… against MUCH BETTER PITCHING too

  172. Fred

    July 30, 2008 at 12:23 pm

    Just because he’s the Phils ‘top’ prospect doesn’t mean squat. The Phils are so bereft of talent on the farm Roy Hobbs could be their ‘top’ prospect. We’re talking about 2 or 3 guys in the whole organization who MAY have some potential at the major league level.

  173. NEPA

    July 30, 2008 at 12:24 pm

    I’m fine with trading Werth for pitching as long as they made up for it by bringing in another OF’er. If not, that would leave Jenkins as the everyday starter. I’d rather stick with our current pitching situation then go through that for the rest of the season.

  174. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 12:26 pm

    I think that Marson has a CHANCE to be a good player, but when he will be hitting in the 7th or 8th spot anyway… you shouldn’t sacrifice better “catching” from your catcher, for more offense from the bottom third of your lineup.

    If you need to trade him for pitching, you have to be willing to pull the trigger.. Pitching is MUCH harder to find that catching/8 hole hitters.. I would much rather keep Carrasco unless you net a top-of-the-rotation pitcher in return

  175. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 12:27 pm

    thats why pat gillick sucks, more than arbuckle its his ultimate responsibility to bring in talent. this organization IS devoid of minor league talent, yes, there are only like 5 guys who might be good major leaguers, and im arguing that marson is one of them.

  176. Pete

    July 30, 2008 at 12:27 pm

    Werth, Blanton, and Golson for Kazmir. Donald for Ramirez. Chance of this happening = 0%, but it’s fun to dream.

  177. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 12:29 pm

    id trade them jimmy rollins for scott kazmir, but even tahts not enough because scott kazmir wont be available like, for years.

  178. Mike M.

    July 30, 2008 at 12:29 pm

    Reallistically speaking, it is doubtful that Boston would give up Manny for future prospects when they are competing for a playoff spot. It would be unfair to the city and the Sox to dump a talented player for future talent. The only likelihood that makes sense is the swap for Burrell and Ramirez with maybe Hanson as a add-on. This has been talked about extensively already and I would rather keep Pat and re-sign to a 2 year deal if possible. The reasons for this are as followed:

    Cost- The costs of Manny’s option for next year I believe is 20 million. If we resign Pat mid-season, I’m sure it would only take 14 or 15 million annually.

    Offense- Although Manny has a much better history than Pat, it is about the time where Manny’s OPS dropoff could be concern because of his age. With Pat being a few years younger, there’s no reason to expect his OPS to be a little lower than this career year.

    Defense- I am not calling Pat fast but Manny would make Pat look like Doug Glanville in left. Manny’s inability to get to any spot in the field is atrocious. Ofcourse, Manny does play the Monster pretty well, but he always plays worse defense away from Boston. Pat catches balls that he should with an accurate arm to boot.

    Laziness- Do you think Manuel’s rule of thumb to be on time and hustle would still be meaningful is Manny is on this team? Jimmy Rollins will further slide into the Manny way, which is a horrible possibility. Pat, on the other hand, hustles (the best he can) and is very supportive of his teammates.

    Therefore, I don’t see why Manny would be an improvement over Pat.

  179. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 12:32 pm

    Gillick sucks because the guys he’s drafted in his two years here aren’t yet “top-prospects” ???

    And actually, Drabek and Savery are ranked fairly high everywhere i’ve looked..

    You’re arguement about GILLICK sucks, steadily revoles around Eaton being terrible (agreed) Jenkies makes too much money (who cares) and Garcia was injured (agreed)

    But you have yet to acknowledge the fact that he has a proven track record, and he’s improved this team in both of the seasons he’s been here..

    You can’t BRING IN TOP-TALENT…AND… TRADE TO IMPROVE YOUR CLUB at the same time.. it doesn’t work.. you can either buy or sell but not both… or can make minor adjustements to find puzzle-pieces like he’s done in the past two years… and we are still a good team, and we still have our top prospects…

  180. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 12:36 pm

    but what happens when we play good teams like in the american league? we lose.

  181. Pete

    July 30, 2008 at 12:36 pm

    I agree it makes no sense to trade Pat for Manny. Especially if they trade Werth, swapping Pat for Manny still leaves them 1 OF short. The Sox might take Donald if they think he’s ready to play – they’ve been looking for a reason to DFA Lugo all year. They have surplus OF, so they wouldn’t be stuck without an OF back. For the Sox, it’s addition by subtraction, as when they traded Nomar in ’04. I can definitely see a Donald/Manny deal if the Sox think he can step in and play. I agree that Manny for prospects only won’t happen, as the Sox will deal with Manny’s BS for his plate production so they can make another WS run this year.

  182. J-Man

    July 30, 2008 at 12:38 pm

    Unless the Phils plan on getting Manny Ramirez,they better not trade Werth unless their getting an offer they can’t turn down because having Jenkins play everyday is going to suck.

  183. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 12:39 pm

    sure you can do both. the red sox do it and the angels do it, the stockpile never ends with those guys. those teams spend more money on their farms than the phillies do, i will guarantee that. tahts where it kills you. a solid farm system enables you to trade prospects away and not sweat it too much, it enables you to let overpaid players walk in free agency withOUT worrying about who will replace them

    the phillies let aaron rowand go and replaced him with an overpaid has been. why? because they didnt have someone on the farm reayd to step right in there.

    theyre going to let burrell walk and replace him with who? greg golson? ok, well i hope that works out but we dont know that for sure. golson is a total guess AND i guarantee hell never put up burrells numbers, ever, in his career, thats pretty obvious though.

  184. Fred

    July 30, 2008 at 12:39 pm

    Does anyone here actually see this team as it’s comprised now winning the WS? Keep the prospects and pray they develop or trade them for help now? Can’t have it both ways.

  185. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 12:42 pm

    this team isnt winning the WS. they have to make these moves to even have a CHANCE at making the playoffs. thats how far theyve fallen.

    6 weeks ago i guaranteed theyd easily win their division because it was a garbage division.

    well guess what? it IS a garbage division and they STILL found ways to screw that up. now were in a dead heat with the mets and marlins and they need to go out and splash in MORE THAN ONE trade to make it happen.

  186. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 12:42 pm

    Geoff, what about the rest of what I asked.. proven track record, improvement, etc.. you keep skirting the issue there

  187. Fred

    July 30, 2008 at 12:47 pm

    The thing about prospects is that they are just that – prospects. I can give an endless list of Phillies ‘top’ prospects who never panned out. Roger Freed, Mike Anderson, Jeff Stone, etc. Great minor league players but couldn’t do it in the big show on a consistent basis.

  188. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 12:49 pm

    The RedSox traded Hanley Ramirez + form Josh Beckett… now an MVP candidate for a CY YOUNG candidate… and they need a SS bad.

    They have a pretty good farm system, but that is mainly through good draft picks, and refusing to trade them away for Johan Sanata and Sabathia etc..

    If the Phillies prospects keep it up they will probably have at least 5 guys in the top-100 in Carrasco, Savery, Marson, Golson and Donald… Drabek’s ceiling is VERY high but he had surgery and is probably 3 years away if not more.. Bastardo has potential. If you trade those guys for MLB players you improve right now, you would be “BUYERS”… if you trade MLB players for prospects right now.. you would be “SELLERS” no team does that at the same time unless its a swap for extreme talent.. Like we mentioned for Halladay… but trades like that don’t often happen

  189. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 12:50 pm

    if they make the playoffs this year, ill give him a alittle bit of credit for putting together a group that showed CONSISTENCY over time in making the playoffs twice in a row, you happy?

    they made the playoffs last year and got HUMILATED, so thats barely a good thing at all. they extended their season for half a week.

  190. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 12:53 pm

    I understand buying and selling, im not retarded.

    by trading werth for something of value like a reliver or someone who can help in mlb, which is doable, you can emulate, perhaps, the hamilton/volquez swap to a lesser extent.

    that was an even trade really. tampa has a good supply of young arms. whats wrong with making room int eh bullpen for a young arm?

  191. Fred

    July 30, 2008 at 12:56 pm

    Drabek has a VERY high ceiling???? He just has Tommy John surgery. That puts him at least a year from even having a toss let alone throwing curve balls. Doesn’t sound like his future is so bright.

  192. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 1:01 pm

    Thats your problem is you’d rather just be constantly negative about this team and this GM.. you still can’t get over yourself and accept the fact that he’s made this team better than it was before he got here.. both by adding pieces at low costs, and by holding on to prospects they felt could either help them or bring back value in return.

    How hot were the Rockies when the Phillies met them in the Playoffs??

    winners of 22-of-23 going into the postseason?? something like.. sometimes you just run into teams that are outplaying you and there isn’t much you can do about it.

    I don’t know if you really do understand it.. because you just said that you can do both… but clearly you can’t get something great without giving up something great in return. You have to either want the NOW guys, or want the FUTURE guys… you can’t trade for both at the same time.

  193. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 1:03 pm

    Really? consistenly negative? thats news to me because I want this team to win everygame it plays, unlike some philadelphia fans who WANT THEM TO LOSE so they can complain about it.

    wanting them to win is not negative. you may percieve it as such because i want them to go about it in a different way than taht in which they seem destined to pursue.

  194. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 1:04 pm

    if you make an even trade with werth you can improve your club RIGHT NOW. even is good.

  195. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 1:05 pm

    Tommy John is a pretty routine thing for young pitchers now… I don’t know that he will ever pan out to anything great, but in terms of “talent” and “prospects” and all that junk that we all agree might never amount to anything… teams would line-up to have Drabek under their control cause the kid has limitless talent.

    That is why I said its going to take a few years for us to find out what he is going to do, but as they rank these guys on talent and potential.. he will remain a top-prospect unless he has another setback… like scot mathesion..

  196. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 1:06 pm

    like most americans, you seem to think that there are only two solutions to a problem (republican or democrat,, buy or sell, etc.). did it ever occur to you that there might be MULTIPLE solutions/ways to approach this scenario? that a dynamic, creative general manager can do both if it improves the team in teh appropriate ways?

  197. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 1:12 pm

    For the past week all you’ve done is complain about the moves they aren’t going to make…

    And then when a deal was close yesterday for a good, veteran reliever for your SS that won’t play here because an MVP blocks him.. you didn’t like that trade at all..

    Who today, do you think they can and should go get.. If you want to hang onto Marson and Carrasco, I’m on board with that, but I don’t think either of them should be kept if a stud pitcher could be had…

    Considering what is out there and how much even situational-relievers cost in a trade… what do you want them to do at this trade deadline??

  198. Fred

    July 30, 2008 at 1:18 pm

    I’ve been a Phillies fan since the collapse of ’64. It’s just that I’ve seen this movie rerun over and over. Phils get close but refused to trade away their ‘top’ prospects who they deem to have a VERY high ceiling.

    In baseball, ‘top’ prospects are not down in AA stuck behind a Ruiz or Coste. ‘Top’ prospects are not stuck on the farm behind a Moyers and Kendricks. At this point in the season under these circumstances if you truly are a ‘top’ prospect you’re in the big show.

    Also the average age for a major leaguer is 28, so if you’re 25 and still in AA – you’re baseball clock is ticking.

  199. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 1:20 pm

    you might be a clown… who the fuck compares MLB trade deadline moves to politics in America ???

    Are “secret trades” more of a Republican, Democratic, or Green Party strategy??

  200. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 1:20 pm

    i wholly agree that you can give up carrasco if it means a stud pitcher comes back in return. were on the same page there…

    i may have been a little out of line about the mahay situation yesterday. my strategy was to trade jimmy rollins for an asset that helps you elsewhere or for SEVERAL assets that help you elsewhere now and in the future and then call up donald to plug that gap. since that wont happen, since theyre not that dynamic of a trading team, then you kind of have to move donald for mahay, yes. thats if youre taking a conventional approach then sure, but i was taking an unconventional approach which will never happen.

    so, if they did get mahay i probably wouldnt be too upset and would calm down, especially if he became a good setup man.

  201. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 1:27 pm

    my point is you have to think in more than two or three dimenstions to be effective at anything regardless of whether or not its sports related. yes, there are more than 3 dimensions, before you ask. time is the 4th dimension. there are more as well but i forgot them.

  202. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 1:28 pm

    i think the phillies fron toffice, unfortunately, appear to all be one dimensional thinkers. in this case, im referring to the fact that theyre only concerned about money, though money isnt really a dimension you get the point.

  203. Fred

    July 30, 2008 at 1:29 pm

    Tommy John surgery is anything but ‘pretty routine’ whether it’s an old or young pitcher. Having a ligament harvested from anther part of ones body then woven in a figure eight pattern through holes drilled in the ulna and humerus bones is anything but routine. And who wouldn’t hang onto his Single A Lakewood contract.

  204. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 1:30 pm

    i think that “Secret Trades” are a construct of the other dimensions. therefore the phillies may not be capable of accomplishing secret trades.

  205. Fred

    July 30, 2008 at 1:32 pm

    What’s with the f-bombs? Can’t we discuss without the use of profanity?

  206. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 1:37 pm

    Fred,

    http://mvn.com/mlb-phillies/2008/02/06/phillies-top-5-prospects-kyle-drabek-5/

    It doesn’t bother me at all if you don’t want to consider Kyle Drabek a “top prospect” or not… i would not lose any sleep if they traded him..

    and about the Tommy John:
    http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=3486

    “That Tommy John surgery seems all too common is perhaps the best measure of its success. While there is still a failure rate of 10 to 15%, most of these happen on younger subjects. It would be more accurate to say that the pitcher fails himself in most cases, rather than the surgery being the problem. “

  207. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 1:38 pm

    Did I just unlock the mystery of who “Darren Daulton” was last week?

    cause whoever he was, it was hilarious

  208. KM

    July 30, 2008 at 2:12 pm

    we could all sit here, speculate, and wait for the phillies to do something, but we all know that unless we are willing to add payroll (ha ha), then we are basically looking at our one lateral move (blanton), and maybe a trade for a marginal lefty in the pen. if we are lucky they will make a trade after the deadline for another marginal player that cleared waivers.

    this organization frustrates me beyond belief, because i know that with a couple moves, and some added payroll, we could be as good or better than the cubs, brewers or mets. we could have had sabathia, we could have had holliday/fuentes, we could have had nady/marte, we could have had harden, we COULD get ibanez, bay and so on. until we are willing to expand the payroll and climb into the top 12, 13 teams in payroll (while being a top 5 market) we are looking at our lateral moves for blanton, gordon, jenkins, seanez, etc. even durbin and dobbs could be considered lateral moves, even tho they have played well this year.

    this organization is not committed to win, they are committed to putting a team on the field that is just good enough to keep their heads above water so they can be in a pennant race every year and sell merchandise, and sell out the ballpark every night.

    i love the phillies, but it is hard to watch them around this time of year when all the other main competitors are getting better and we stay they same.

  209. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 2:13 pm

    dont forget, theyre going to tell you that they spent 100-110 mm on this payroll but so far theyve only spent 90mm

  210. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 2:15 pm

    well said though, but i think theyre are in the top 15 in payroll, i knwo they are, NOT in the farm system though.

    thats how incompetent wade/gillick have been at times. they spend all that money and STILL its not enough.

  211. KM

    July 30, 2008 at 2:20 pm

    i think they are right around 13, 14 – i would be ecstatic if they could break the top 10, althought i would settle for top 11, 12. being the top 10 is the difference between having jenkins in right field, and having bay in right field.

  212. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 2:21 pm

    Geoff… again… what the F…. look at the signing bonuses they’ve given recent draft picks.. competitive with every other top team. They are developing their latin-american system… its going to take a while to catch up to the Braves, A’s, NY teams, etc.. but they are doing it.

    Only we haven’t gone and blown money on overrated players like Dice-K, Key Igawa, Fukudome, etc…

    Let me see where you can look at the Farm System payrolls and where the Phillies rank.

  213. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 2:22 pm

    Jason Bay is property of the Pirates… if you want to give up Carrasco, Marson, and two other prospects.. you can get him on the Phillies, where again, PITCHING is the area that needs the most improvemnt

  214. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 2:24 pm

    I agree they are doing it, they are improving in that area but they havent caught up and until they do theyre going to hear it. they need to be reminded constantly.

    im not saying blow money on dice-k and stuff liek that. just spend money on the prospects.

    the farm has gotten better, much better, but it was nonexistent before, its terrible/bad now. so tahts an improvement.

  215. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 2:24 pm

    but were not giving up marson, remember?

  216. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 2:27 pm

    well then we’re not getting BAY.. and so we should stop bashing them for not getting BAY.

    If they are clearly improving, and its getting better, and Gillick is cleaning up Ed Wade’s mess….. WHY DO YOU KEEP INSISTING THE GILLICK IS INCOMPETENT.

    Is there really somewhere you can see what they spend on their Farm System, or was that just a gut-feeling you had too??

  217. KM

    July 30, 2008 at 2:31 pm

    We are sitting at number 13, while we were a top 5 payroll in 2004. Also we are one of the top 5 markets in sports

    Top 15 Payrolls of 2008

    Team Total payroll
    1. Yankees $209,081,579
    2. Tigers $138,685,197
    3. Mets $138,293,378
    4. Red Sox $133,440,037
    5. White Sox $121,152,667
    6. Angels $119,216,333
    7. Cubs $118,595,833
    8. Dodgers $118,536,038
    9. Mariners $117,993,982
    10. Braves $102,424,018
    11. Cardinals $100,624,450
    12. Blue Jays $98,641,957
    13. Phillies $98,269,881
    14. Astros $88,930,415
    15. Brewers $81,004,167

  218. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 2:32 pm

    google it.

  219. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 2:33 pm

    right within the range i thought. 90-100. still not spending about 10mm that they said they alreayd spent, remember?

  220. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 2:39 pm

    Don’t make me Google something that you made up and can’t find something to prove it…

    not even to be a d!ck. I would really actually like to see what teams are spending on their farms and how that relates to their real payrolls…

  221. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 2:40 pm

    i found it once a while back, let me try

  222. Don M

    July 30, 2008 at 2:43 pm

    I know some of those teams get money by having their own TV networks and god knows how all that works… But how great would it be if comcast owned the Phillies and Ed Sniper was in charge… our payroll would be all the money that they had!

  223. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 2:44 pm

    yes, i hope he buys the phillies. that would be awesome

  224. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 2:45 pm

    thats not necessarily it but tahts interesting to read…

  225. Geoff

    July 30, 2008 at 2:46 pm

    ill try and find it after work im still multitasking over here

  226. ron

    July 30, 2008 at 4:24 pm

    who gives a damn about what someone from baseball america says; last year baseball america had homer bailey as the next mario soto for the reds, but while bailey has sucked and has been up and down between Cincy and AAA, Kyle Kendrick snuck into the Majors and has managed to be a very consistent cog in this staff. Marson has been hitting over .300 his last two seasons and will be good for the phillies. If people like Keith Law and Steve Phillips knew what they were talking about, they would still have jobs in MLB instead of putting out hindsight and other nonsense. Another thing, I’m glad the phillies dont have as good a minor league system as Milwaukee; this would implicate that the phillies have been a below .500 organization for the last 26 years, but the last 8 seasons have proven otherwise with his phils picking above 15 in those years. As mentioned, you get matt laporta and Ryan Braun like players when you’re awful.

  227. Trent

    July 30, 2008 at 11:53 pm

    yo guys i think this manny deal is bullshit…..we all know the fish are gonna land him in a deal…….i say we shoot for that middle relief pitcher were dying for and continue with our success…….were doin fine with pat da bat, hes havin a great year and hes been an awesome 5 hole batter…….the manny deal aint happenin so i dont know why you guys keep talkin about it

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

Phillies Nation has been bringing Phillies fans together since 2004 with non-stop news, analysis, trade rumors, trips, t-shirts, and other fun stuff!

Browse the Archives

Browse by Category

Copyright Phillies Nation, LLC 2004-2016
Not Affiliated with Major League Baseball or the Philadelphia Phillies

To Top