Phils lose third straight to Cards, possible ground in Oswalt trade talks – Phillies Nation
2010 Game Recaps

Phils lose third straight to Cards, possible ground in Oswalt trade talks

Trade talks with Roy Oswalt have stalled just a bit; the Phillies are balking at his need for a guaranteed option year.  However, the Phils didn’t do much to help their case in luring the Houston ace to the City of Brotherly Love  losing a third straight game to  the Cardinals and six of their last seven.  Oswalt, who has a full no-trade clause, has made it clear he wants to go to a team that is in the thick of the playoff hunt.

The Phillies think they still are.  The only problem is they aren’t playing like it.

For a second straight game the Phillies have only managed one run.  For the series they have only scored six times.  A huge difference to St. Louis who have put 20 on the board in the first three games.  Joe Blanton (3-6, 6.03) pitched well through the first six innings allowing only one run.  Matt Holliday led off the seventh with a home run that put the Cards ahead for good.  The one extra run was plenty.  Blanton then allowed three runs in the eighth after a lead off single by Aaron Miles followed by an error charged to catcher Carlos Ruiz which allowed Brendan Ryan to reach base.  The next hitter Felipe Lopez hit a two-run double to right field and later scored on a Colby Rasmus sac fly.

Did Charlie Manuel leave him in too long?  Blanton has always been an inning eater but has managed to implode in almost every outing for at least one inning.

Cardinals rookie Jaime Garcia (9-4, 2.21) went seven innings allowing one run and four hits.  The Phillies put some pressure on Garcia with the bases loaded in the seventh but Blanton struck out swinging for the final out.  Again, why not put a pinch hitter in that spot?  The percentage of a ball in play from a bench player would have been greatly higher than allowing Blanton to take swings.

The one bright spot was Ryan Howard hitting his 22nd home run and collecting RBI number 75.  He is tied for 2nd in the NL for home runs and leads the league in RBIs.  He drove in and scored the only run in the 5-1 loss.

The Phillies will send Cole Hamels (7-7, 3.63) to the hill tomorrow to face Adam Wainwrigth (14-5, 2.02).  Game time is 2:15 EST.



  1. Manny

    July 22, 2010 at 12:20 am

    Charlie lost this one all by himself.

  2. Andrew from Waldorf

    July 22, 2010 at 12:32 am

    He really should have the Jeltz.
    Its getting tough to be positive but I am gonna try.

  3. Morris Buttermaker

    July 22, 2010 at 12:34 am

    Manny, you are totally right. I don’t know what Charlie was thinking when he told the offense to only score one run. That was a terrible strategy.

    Jayson Werth for Roy Oswalt? Hell, we’d be lucky to get some Roy Rogers for Jayson Werth.

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  5. Andrew from Waldorf

    July 22, 2010 at 12:52 am

    Charlie chose to let Joe blanton bat in the 7th inning with the bases loaded and 2 outs. Tied 1-1
    One could make the arguement thats why they only scored 1 run.
    Joe pitched well enough to win tongiht. Instead the old man left him in till he gave up 5 runs.

  6. Scotch Man

    July 22, 2010 at 1:02 am

    While I doubt letting Valdez PH for Blanton would have produced a better result, it’s the thought that counts. STUPID MOVE.

    At this point, I’m not sure getting Oswalt is the greatest idea. This team doesn’t look like a winner at all. Standing pat may be best for everyone.

  7. jt

    July 22, 2010 at 1:13 am

    why did ben francisco get jeltz?uncle cholly should of he did a terrible job managing tonight…sure valdez isn’t a great hitter,but he’s more likely to come up with a hit then blanton…

  8. Andrew from Waldorf

    July 22, 2010 at 1:25 am

    The teams not scoring. That was a scoring chance. They are so few and far between.

    I am still watching the mets. Tied 3-3 in the 12th at arizona

  9. bacardipr05

    July 22, 2010 at 1:32 am

    Oswalt looks like he is going to the Cardinals…the cardinals look like the team to beat this year…todays performance didnt help the cause..

  10. Andrew from Waldorf

    July 22, 2010 at 2:33 am

    It took till 2 30 AM
    But the Mutts blew it. Its the Diamondbacks first sweep of another team since aug 2009. The Mutts play so well with Beltran.

    Was a pleasure listening to Darrin Sutton and Mark Grace. It is possible to have great announcers. Wish the Phillies did.

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  12. Mark

    July 22, 2010 at 6:01 am

    ………and yet are still ahead of the Phillies in the standings…lol

  13. Ted Bell

    July 22, 2010 at 6:20 am

    I have to agree with Conlin on this one. For the money, Brett Myers (29 years old with a reasonable 2011 option) may be a better choice than Oswalt right now. 34 year old pitchers scare me almost as much as 38 year old leftfielders and 35 year old thirdbasemen.

    I’m Ted Bell.

  14. The Dipsy

    July 22, 2010 at 7:54 am

    Roy Oswalt is very eager to exit Houston and Ed Wade wants to rid himself of that contract. There was a dust up between the two earlier in the year when Oswalt demanded a trade and Wade told him to shove it. While I’m sure Oswalt would love to have the Phils pick that option up, until a second team enters the fray and indicates a willingness to pay Oswalt off, he really has nothing to bargain with. I doubt that he would stand by his request past the deadline and be forced to stay in Houston for the rest of the season and maybe into 2011 when the Phils don’t comply.

    Further, if the Phils do come up with whole $40m, I am not giving them JA Happ. For the service of taking this debt off of Houston’s hands, I would give them a nice A prospect and some middling ones and I believe that Wade would be glad to have it. Or they can have Happ, Ibanez, and Lidge 🙂

    The Dipsy

  15. Dave

    July 22, 2010 at 8:03 am

    How did Charlie Manuel not get the Jeltz award? “Two out hits are pretty tough to get.” No shi*. Especially when you let your fat pitcher hit. New manager, new GM and major shakeups on this team. This is EMBARRASSING!

  16. Chuck

    July 22, 2010 at 8:03 am

    See…this is exactly why it’s s STUPID idea to trade Jayson Werth. How many right-handed bats do we have on the team?

    I understand Charlie’s thinking with leaving Blanton in. He was pitching well….probably the best he has all year….and all he had was Valdez to hit. In hindsight, yeah, he probably should have made the move.

    But if we are so thin with right-handed bats that there is only Wilson Valdez to pinch-hit….then why would you get rid of one of your most dangerous right-handed bats in the line-up??

    To me, unless you’re gonna get Oswalt or Haren AND one other impact player, such as a stud reliever, a potent RIGHT-handed bat or a starter like one of Tampa’s…it’s really pointless to trade Werth. It just concedes the season.

    And the season ISN’T over. No ground lost last night, guys. Still 7 games out in the division and 4 in the Wild Card. There’s plenty of time yet.

  17. The Dipsy

    July 22, 2010 at 8:18 am

    I agree with you Chuck that in order to compete we need another starter (Oswalt) and righty bat to replace Werth AND a competent closer. You can’ win the WS without a closer and we don’t have one.

    The Dipsy

  18. The Dipsy

    July 22, 2010 at 8:24 am

    Food for thought: Oswalt (pick up option) and Lindstrom for Happ and Lidge. I guess this would all depend on how much Wade likes Happ. I wouldn’t be opposed to throwing in a Galvis and obviously a Mayberry, Savery type.

    The Dipsy

  19. Papa Thompson

    July 22, 2010 at 8:25 am

    When it became evident the cardinals were pitching around chooch, I was pretty shocked to hear wheels and tmac say there’s no way you take blanton out at that point.

    I understand he didn’t throw many pitches, but we were getting late in the game there. And that was a good chance to score and turn it over to the bullpen for 3 innings. I would have expected somebody in the booth to at least note Charlie had a decision to make there.

    And this is what’s really aggravating …. Valdez was the only RH option (and not a good one) because Charlie insisted on a RH stacked lineup — in a game, ironically, where the only Phillies run came off a HR by the only lefty in the lineup.

    I guess what I’m saying there is Valdez didn’t have to be the guy to hit with bases loaded, ESPECIALLY when Charlie chose a couple innings later to allow RH Blanton to pitch to a LH in a jam (2-run double), THEN brought in LH Romero to force a bunt and intentionally walk somebody, THEN pulled him so he could match up RH-RH with the hottest hitter in the game. THEN saw another run given up on LH-RH matchup.

    This was a maddening game. Archival-quality Charlie Manuel.

    I thought walking Holliday in that situation was a no-brainer. You would have had JC working against a LH with the bases loaded.

  20. SpinJamin

    July 22, 2010 at 8:30 am

    Charlie is one of the DUMBEST managers in the game. He proves it on almost a daily basis. He may be great for the clubhouse and what not, but as far as his managerial skills. They don’t exist…..PERIOD.

  21. Manny

    July 22, 2010 at 8:34 am

    You didn’t HAVE to pinch-hit with Valdez just because he’s a righty… you could’ve gone with Raul (an experienced player who has a track record of hitting lefties well). In these type of spots, you gotta go with the best bench bat you got.. and last night, that was Ibanez.

  22. Chuck

    July 22, 2010 at 8:40 am

    Manny, I would have used Raul there, too. AND….he’s been swing BETTER as of late.


    Charlie Manuel might not be the best “in-game” strategist……but to call him one of the “DUMBEST managers in the game” is pretty DUMB as well. “Managerial skills” reach a lot Farther than deciding on pitching changes and pinch hitters.

  23. Chris Wheeler

    July 22, 2010 at 8:48 am

    Hey bloggers and hoggers of space…… Ed Wade is toying with us. He resents Amaro, jr, and will do nothing to help his old buddy. Don’t kid yourself. Ed is meaner and more spiteful than anyone I know, except for maybe myself. We need to focus on Dan Haren now. It is that simple and we need to be willing to say goodbye to Happ. But Haren and Happ are both under 30.

  24. Manny

    July 22, 2010 at 8:50 am

    The best job he’s done this season as far as ‘in-game” managing was at this year’s All-Star game. No kidding.

  25. Morris Buttermaker

    July 22, 2010 at 9:04 am

    Yea, Raul and Valdez have both come up so huge in the clutch this year. Raul would have popped up or struck out. Valdez would have hit a weak ground ball. Don’t kid yourselves with speculation. We all know that is what would have happened. It’s what has been happening for the past 8 weeks. Ok, and then after Valdez/Ibanez hits, who do you want pitching? Baez, Contreras, Herdon, Madson, Lidge or Durbin? What combination of those pitchers do you want to come in to shut down the Cardinals who are scoring runs at will since the All-Star Break. And as Charlie said, look what happened in the 8th. Jayson Werth came up to bat with 2 men on and 2 out, and of course he hit a weak ground ball to second.

    Leaving Blanton in to bat just shows you how little faith Charlie has in the bullpen, and in offense. And I agree with him. I did not expect them to win last night anyway. There are too many guys not contributing. Ryan Howard is the only guy hitting right now. And we keep talking about all of the injuries. Out of the 8 players to start in the field on Opening Day, 1 of them is injured. Just 1. 7 of the 8 starters have been playing together since Saturday, they are 1-4 since then, and the 1 comes from Carlos Marmol falling apart and a catcher missing an easy tag at home plate. These guys are professional athletes, it’s time to start acting like it.

  26. NickFromGermantown

    July 22, 2010 at 9:12 am

    I think you go easy on Cheeseburger Joe. He had a good game before that last inning.

    We’ll be lucky if we escape this series with a win. After that Reds series, who would have though?

    Phils need to make a move. And fast.

  27. Bacardipr05

    July 22, 2010 at 9:14 am

    I agree i think Haren is the better choice here……….KEEP HAPP! it will be a mistake….Mark my words…Halladay Cole Haren Blanton Happ and possible Kendrick or another young arm making spot starts wouldnt be a bad line the way Figgy was claimed by the Astros..another mistake..he actually was pitching well….

  28. NickFromGermantown

    July 22, 2010 at 9:14 am

    Hopefully talks with Houston stall a la last year with Toronto and we swoop in to get Haren…

  29. Jeff

    July 22, 2010 at 10:23 am

    Your wrong Morris. I dont care what raul and valdez have done. here is the bottom line. The Phillies offense is not scoring ANY runs. You have a 1-1 tie in the 7th inning. Bases loaded. You have a better chance with those two then Blanton. We all know Blanton was striking out. Which will kill any chance of winning. That was the game. Charlie might be a big grandfather but I am tired of him. He has no idea how to handle the pitching staff. He let Fran hit when he should of used Raul. This team is not winning anything this year. Do not bring in Oswalt. Haren would be the guy if any. Resign Werth if you can. He will come back strong after this contract is done. Then just sit Raul and bring up Brown. I have never seen this team struggle this bad. Bad all around.

  30. Manny

    July 22, 2010 at 10:39 am


    Factually, you’re wrong. Raul’s numbers this season with runners in scoring position and 2 outs are better than his regular numbers. 10 hits, 8 walks in 38 at-bats (13 RBIs).

    Ditto for Valdez. 7 hits in 24 at-bats with runners in scoring position and 2 outs (9 RBIs).

    So to start things off, your statement “Yea, Raul and Valdez have both come up so huge in the clutch this year. Raul would have popped up or struck out. Valdez would have hit a weak ground ball. Don’t kid yourselves with speculation” is simply wrong.

    Second, you got to consider that these two are hitters.. Blanton is a PITCHER.. who can’t hit and has ZERO RBIs in 2010.

    And don’t even get me started with taking other things into account, such as Raul hitting lefties well in his career, or intangibles such as experience in these type of pressure situations.

    AND EVEN IF Raul/Valdez/whomever would’ve been used and would’ve struck out or not driven a run in, at least you gave the team a CHANCE to win and break out of this seemingly perpetual slump. Letting Blanton go out there to “hit” is giving up on a really good scoring opportunity that came relatively late in the game.

  31. Lewisauce

    July 22, 2010 at 10:43 am

    Valdez, Raul … I would have actually put Gload in. Sometimes, you gotta go with your best pinch hitter (that’s not saying much on this squad, but Gload has been the best pinch guy) regardless of the L-R matchup.

    Whatever. ANY of them would have been better than Blanton at the dish there.

    This loss is 90 percent Charlie’s fault. I’m disgusted.


  32. Morris Buttermaker

    July 22, 2010 at 10:46 am

    Yea, you have a better chance of scoring a run there with a pinch hitter batting, but do you have a better chance of winning the game? The bullpen is atrocious and had pitched 7 innings the night before. Since Charlie is such a moron, what would you have done with the pitching staff? Which of the studs from the bullpen would you have used to nail down the 3-1 victory? Give me some names of how you would have handled it. You’re clutching for straws when you are crying that Wilson Valdez was not used as a pinch hitter.

    I would love to see how you geniuses would handle a lineup with 7 guys who are not hitting and 1 guy who is. Rollins, Werth, Victorino, Ibanez, Ruiz and Polanco are doing absolutely nothing at the plate right now. Pop-ups, strike outs and ground outs are all you are getting from them. And the occasional base running blunder. Yet it is the manager’s fault.

    Yea, and we should totally try to lock up Werth and his 2nd worst in the NL, 4th worst in the majors batting average with runners in scoring position.

  33. Chuck

    July 22, 2010 at 10:48 am

    I agree that Charlie probably should have pinch-hit in that situation…..but to say that the loss is 90 percent his fault is just ridiculous. Last I checked, the manager doesn’t hit, pitch or field.

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  35. Georgie

    July 22, 2010 at 11:08 am

    At first I too thought Charlie was nuts for letting PhatJoe bat with the bases loaded, but then you take a look at the bullpen, and the sorry-a$$ bench, and then you think, oh, WTF, just keep Blanton in the game, it really doesn’t matter. Ryan looked pretty ticked off after the game, there is NO chemistry among any of the players on the team anymore. I can’t begin to understand what has brought them to this point, they all used to be so close, now it’s like they can’t stand the sight of each other.

    I still wonder if they feel betrayed by the F.O…..Jimmy came right out and said they were all upset that Rub let Cliff Lee go. Can you imagine how thrilled the team was for those few hours when they had Halladay AND Lee? I mean, it was all there, a few bullpen and bench tweaks, but NOOOOO, we need to restock the farm. I doubt that excuse went over well with the players, so maybe their frame of mind is that, if management isn’t going to do all they can to put the best team on the field, why should we give a sh!t?

    I am TOTALLY disappointed in the Phillies right now, TOTALLY!

  36. Morris Buttermaker

    July 22, 2010 at 11:13 am

    “At first I too thought Charlie was nuts for letting PhatJoe bat with the bases loaded, but then you take a look at the bullpen, and the sorry-a$$ bench, and then you think, oh, WTF, just keep Blanton in the game, it really doesn’t matter”

    That is exactly how I feel. It is just a matter of losing 5-3 or 5-1.

  37. branderson

    July 22, 2010 at 11:14 am

    I am getting sick and tired of seeing pitchers stay in games too long. I know the bullpen needs to be rested but seriously take Blanton out after 7. He gives up 2 runs and then let the pen get the final two outs (possibly one). His ERA would be much lower if they try to avoid allowing runs as opposed to eating innings. I know it is a simple thought but it makes a ton of sense.

    I’d be much happier with a 2-1 loss here than letting Joe give up 5.

    No comment on the offense. Crossing my fingers for Howard to continue his homer/rbi pace to bring it to an overwhelming level then he can start getting MVP mentions.

  38. branderson

    July 22, 2010 at 11:16 am

    @ Morris, Polanco isn’t hitting? Are you kidding

    I know you have a lot of good points in your post but c’mon. Do you even watch the Phils?

  39. Philly Texan

    July 22, 2010 at 11:47 am

    The only solace in this season is Ryan Howard.

    Anyone complaining about that contract NOW?

    Leads the league in RBIs again (on a team that’s not scoring). Second in HR. And he’s hitting .300.

    He’s having a better offensive season than Pujols, A-Rod, Texeira, Gonzalez, Fielder…all except maybe Votto (where the numbers are close.)

    GIven all the team’s problems, I’ve very glad the Big Man is locked up and not headed for FA next year.

  40. bfo_33

    July 22, 2010 at 12:57 pm

    I would have pinch hit Raul, who has pretty neutral splits ove the past two years. Get the runs when you have a chance. While I don’t agree with leaving Blanton in to hit, I understand it, and don’t think it was dumb.

    Show me a team that has good chemistry when in a funk, and I’ll show you a bunch of losers. Winning builds chemistry on a competitve team (except for soccer, where if they start winning, they sleep with each other’s wives, or solicit underage prostitutes).

    No ground lost, bottom was hit, now for the turnaround. It starts this afternoon.

  41. Lefty

    July 22, 2010 at 12:59 pm

    Major League Management 101 – You absolutely MUST pinch hit for your pitcher in that situation. I don’t care if it’s Halladay, Strasburg or Jimenez. You pinch hit with the bases loaded in that situation. Righty bat, Lefty bat, undependable bullpen- none of that matters! Anyone with half a brain knows this. There is simply no argument anyone can make to not give a bat to someone with a 1 in 4 chance to put a ball in play over someone with a 1 in 10 chance in a tie ballgame, late innings. And everyone ( except Cholly ) knows that Joe’s going to implode at some point, he’s proven it over and over.

  42. Bruce

    July 22, 2010 at 1:22 pm

    Someone here asked how many RH hitters (besides Werth) the Phillies have available? Lets see…Rollins ,Victorino (both switch hitters), Valdez, Polanco and Ruiz. Platoon Francisco with Werth and how many RH hitters do you want in the line-up? 😉

  43. George

    July 22, 2010 at 1:26 pm

    The way Blanton had pitched, I can see why he’d be left in in a tie game, especially considering the frightful bullpen which has been worked extensively in this series and come up short every time. He had been pitching like an ace all night, and it wasn’t that likely he’d be hit hard in the eighth, which he really wasn’t. Bear in mind that two of those five runs were unearned, and one was scored because of that same lame bullpen everyone says should have been used sooner.

    Manuel admitted that he had a difficult choice. He just chose to leave his starter in. It wasn’t a matter of stupidity, or a particularly bad choice. It was simply making a decision that didn’t work out.

  44. Bruce

    July 22, 2010 at 1:53 pm

    If Manuel does not have complete confidence in his relievers, what does that say about the bullpen for this season? The rotation is taking a hit with just 3 starters and a guy named Worley available. What are GM Amaro’s priorites with trade deadline fast approaching? Considering the team’s current situation in the standings with a record of 48-46 and no sign of coming out of it, will Amaro reevaluate his priorities and look to next year? I do think he will “salary dump” Werth and hope to get something in return in prospects or bullpen help?

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