Phillies Trade Wilson Valdez to Reds – Phillies Nation
Analysis

Phillies Trade Wilson Valdez to Reds

So long, Wilson. (AP)

According to the Cincinnati Reds twitter profile, they’ve struck a deal to acquire Wilson Valdez from the Phillies for lefty Jeremy Horst.

Here is the statement from the team:

Horst, 26, made 12 relief appearances for the Reds last year and went 0-0 with a 2.93 ERA.  He spent most of the season with triple-A Louisville, where he posted a 1-4 record and had a 2.81 ERA in 36 games, while holding opposing hitters to a .219 batting average.  On six occasions for Louisville, Horst pitched at least 3.0 innings and had a 0.83 ERA (2 ER, 21.2 IP) in those games.

Originally selected by the Reds in the 21st round of the 2007 draft, Horst will be a non-roster invitee to major league spring training for the Phillies.

Valdez spent the last two years with the Phillies, hitting .249 this past season with one home run and 30 RBI in 99 games.  The 33-year-old played second base, shortstop and third base for the Phillies and went 1-0 in one pitching appearance on May 25 against the Reds.

The Phillies are now at 38 players on their 40-man roster.

This certainly opens things up for the Phillies when it comes to the roster. They can go out and sign another utility guy or scour the minor league level for someone of that ilk. Some middle infielder names still available are Aaron Miles, Bill Hall, Jeff Keppinger, Ryan Theriot, Edgar Renteria, Miguel Tejada, and Felipe Lopez, among others.

So long, Wilson. We’ll always have that 19-inning game.

66 Comments

66 Comments

  1. EricL

    January 25, 2012 at 4:37 pm

    Uh oh. I really hope they pluck a utility infielder off the scrap heap now. I do not want to see Michael Martinez in anything more than an Iron Pig jersey.

    • Dave L

      January 25, 2012 at 6:12 pm

      I’m with you on that!
      We know that Rollins,Utley and Polanco are prone to breaking down for extended periods.
      We need to do better than pick someone off the scrap heap. We need a guy who could start and make an impact, not just fill the void until someone comes off the IR. We have major issues offensively and can’t afford to plug in a Martinez or someone offensively challenged.

      • Phillibuster

        January 25, 2012 at 11:08 pm

        That’s part of why we picked up Ty Wigginton to fill in at 1st until Howard is healed, instead of a prototypical 1B kinda guy.

      • joycedaffodil

        January 26, 2012 at 1:48 pm

        Couldn’t agree more. We enjoyed watching Valdez and enjoyed seeing his enthusiasm.
        Rollins, Utley and Polanco are approaching that certain age where small things mean longer recovery and always there is something that doesn’t come back fully. Last year, as we consider the injury lineup it seems Valdez was almost a full timer. It was a guess as to which position he would play. Bon Voyage to a great spirit.

  2. Manny

    January 25, 2012 at 4:42 pm

    Renteria! Please get Renteria!! One of my favorite all-time players 🙂

    At this point a minor league deal will get it done!

    • Manny

      January 25, 2012 at 4:55 pm

      That being said, I will miss Wilson. He filled-in admirably (at times) for our starters when they went down with injuries… and that pitching performance against the Reds (Votto, Bruce) will be THE most memorable moment of the 2011 season.

  3. Jobin

    January 25, 2012 at 4:52 pm

    Is he lefty or righty (he’s a lefty)? Seriously, why would you leave out a detail like that?

  4. Paul

    January 25, 2012 at 4:55 pm

    2 words….. Dumb move!

    • schmenkman

      January 25, 2012 at 5:11 pm

      2 more…. so far.

      i.e. if it means Martinez gets substantial playing time, then yes. But it’s a long way to Apri 5th.

  5. psujoe

    January 25, 2012 at 5:12 pm

    Theriot and keppinger are better, but you probably wont be able to get them for under a mil. No more Miny mart, please.

    • Pat Gallen

      January 25, 2012 at 5:16 pm

      You might be able to. If you stash mini mart in AAA for the year, you save his contract. That would be like $1.4 mil total with Valdez gone.

      • Tom

        January 26, 2012 at 12:30 am

        I agree Pat especially Theriot.! He’s a solid player and an offensive upgrade from Wilson…and Cliff Lee wouldn’t have to face him for at least one year!!

  6. Don M

    January 25, 2012 at 5:18 pm

    If they can get Ryan Theriot on the cheap, that would be the cats pajamas …. though i’d imagine they want someone that can also play 3b ?? Theriot has been mainly 2b/SS

    Guess it depends on how much money they want to throw at the bench.. and if they like Mini Mart as much as I think they do

    • Joseph

      January 25, 2012 at 5:26 pm

      Cats pajamas, haha wow.

      • brooks

        January 25, 2012 at 6:29 pm

        Cats pajamas?

  7. Chris

    January 25, 2012 at 5:34 pm

    You know Valdez wasn’t anything special but I liked having him on the team. Hopefully they make an upgrade and not a sideways move or worse a move Martinez. I don’t want to see Martinez play ever again. He’s not good Charlie and Rube. Put him out of his misery.

  8. Don M

    January 25, 2012 at 5:46 pm

    While I obviously agree that Martinez is nothing special by any means . . . . how many teams’ “25th Man” is a really good player?

    His value is in the fact that he can play just about any position on the field, has good speed, and can stand on either side of the plate with a bat in his hands ..

    Tomas Perez, So Taguch, Eric Bruntlett, etc . . . . if you can upgrade over Martinez, that would be great.. but seriously as the 25th man on the roster, he shouldn’t ever be an issue

    • EricL

      January 25, 2012 at 10:14 pm

      Don, it’s not that he’s the 25th man, it’s that he’s really the only remaining viable option on the roster as a backup for 3 infield positions currently manned by guys who all missed significant time to injury last season. If he was like a 5th/6th outfielder, sure, but as a guy who will need to replace Utley/Rollins and Polanco at various times that guy is going to see his fair share of ABs, and they really can’t go to a guy who hit .196/.258/.282

      Also, he’s got mediocre speed at best. He’s not fast.

      • Chris

        January 25, 2012 at 10:37 pm

        I always see people call him fast and I always wonder who they’re watching when they come up with that assessment. Just because he’s a small switch hitter doesn’t make him fast. Also he can’t bunt worth anything and your bench utility infielder should probably be able to do that especially if he’s God awful at the plate.

  9. Psujoe

    January 25, 2012 at 5:49 pm

    Wiggington can play 3b in a pinch. Theriot would be nice if the $ is right.

  10. bacardipr05

    January 25, 2012 at 5:54 pm

    Kind of shocking that they did this…Ummm Kind of retarded in a way.

  11. Mazinman

    January 25, 2012 at 6:02 pm

    Sad to see Wilson go. Does anyone know more about Jeremy Horst?

  12. betasigmadeltashag

    January 25, 2012 at 6:03 pm

    I know Wilson got bashed on here a lot, he did hit well after the seventh inning and with runners in scoring position, and was an above average defensive player with a monster arm. I am going to miss him and thought he was a good fit as the 24th or 25th man on the Phillies roster. Many people on here have called me out for my blind faith in the FO, but I think they have a plan and I do not think it is Mini Mart. RAJ is brewing up something maybe not a blockbuster deal or trade, but I think he has his eye on someone to fill that roll a lot of small moves opening up space for something. Not sure what it is but it will not be a surprise to me

  13. bacardipr05

    January 25, 2012 at 6:07 pm

    I hope they have a plan Beta, cause Operation Mini-Mart wont cut it.

  14. Chuck A.

    January 25, 2012 at 6:12 pm

    I really don’t understand this move at all. Someone above called it a “dumb move” and I kind of have to agree. Hope I’m wrong.

    And please no more Mini Mart.

  15. Bob in Bucks

    January 25, 2012 at 6:24 pm

    So we lost the MLB leader GIDP. Good fielder but that is all. Firming up bullpen is more important. There is always a utility infielder available.

  16. brooks

    January 25, 2012 at 6:35 pm

    Goodbye Exxon!

    Miggy would be quite a dugout boost but I’m sure the former MVP would come at a pretty penny. Miggy does 3B and SS. We do have to be concerned about the length of time that Poly, Jimmy and Chase will probably spend on the bench and, like everyone else, I do not want to see more of the mini mart.

  17. TheDipsy

    January 25, 2012 at 6:41 pm

    I think Mini Mart is just fine as the 25th guy.

    The Dipsy

  18. brooks

    January 25, 2012 at 6:42 pm

    So this year (so far) we have lost 2 out of our 4 Z’s – Valdez and Ibanez. These guys for the most part batted 5th, 6th, 7th and 8th in the lineup and followed by the pitcher – it was a space filler if nothing else. In a close game, it was always a very quick half inning when these guys were due up, not too unhappy to see that quad break up.

  19. Lefty

    January 25, 2012 at 7:49 pm

    I like this better than 4.5m for a declining Francisco Cordero. Maybe now it’s Freddy Galvis turn.

    • Chris

      January 25, 2012 at 8:38 pm

      Freddy Galvis not getting PT full time would be so so stupid for the Phillies. I don’t think he’ll turn out to be anything special but you’re not doing his development any favors by making him fill a bench spot in the big leagues.

      • EricL

        January 25, 2012 at 10:16 pm

        Seconded.

        I don’t want to see Galvis wasting away on the bench when he could be getting regular ABs in Allentown.

      • Lefty

        January 26, 2012 at 12:24 am

        Uh Guys,- I don’t just make this shit up. You can first it, second it, or even one hundred it-

        “But now that Jimmy Rollins is under contract through at least 2014 and Chase Utley is at second through 2013, Galvis’ current path to the majors is in a reserve role (barring injury). ”

        Read more: http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/phillies_zone/With-depth-Valdez-becomes-expendable.html#ixzz1kXRGsO1I

        http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/phillies_zone/With-depth-Valdez-becomes-expendable.html

      • Chris

        January 26, 2012 at 1:04 am

        But that’s assuming Galvis is major league ready already which quite frankly he isn’t. He may eventually be a reserve but he’s still young and hasn’t done a full season at AAA. Why jump him to the majors just to be a bench guy? I can understand if one of those guys goes down for a long stretch and they want to bring him up but otherwise they’re setting him up for failure. He loses out on good development opportunities and rots on the bench.

      • Lefty

        January 26, 2012 at 6:41 am

        I don’t know- I guess someone has to ask Ruben those questions. It mentions Pete Orr too.

      • Lefty

        January 26, 2012 at 7:18 am

        Chris, sorry that was a little crass, you make good points. But if Ruben thinks he’s ready, and he beats out MM, it sounds like he’s going to bring him up. Listen to the Jay’s interview in the latest post.

  20. Psujoe

    January 25, 2012 at 9:46 pm

    RAJ seems intent on getting the squad some lefty bull pen arms. Deal is Not bad. As much as I can’t stand Mini Mart he’s fine as #25. You just can’t have him as 25 if Valdez is 24, Snyder 23, injured Gloud 22.

  21. Bruce

    January 25, 2012 at 11:43 pm

    My question is what does Amaro see in Horst to make that trade? If I’m correct, last season was Horst’s first in the Majors and only 12 relief appearances. Did he show enough to warrant Amaro’s faith in him and give up a valuable all purpose utility player in Valdez?

    Horst is a “non-roster invitee” to Phillies spring training? That would suggest Horst may not even be with the team once the season starts. And we gave up Valdez for him? Reading between the lines, it looks more like salary dumping (Valdez recently avoided arbitration for $900.000 plus) and with a bit of luck , Horst does not disappoint in ST.

  22. 800812

    January 26, 2012 at 1:51 am

    Kurt Bevacqua!

  23. TheDipsy

    January 26, 2012 at 7:59 am

    I think that if Ruben traded for Horst, then he must see something. I like that now we are stockpiling, seemingly, lefty bullpen arms and we can just see which one pans out. Savery, Willis, Horst, etc.

    Hey, Mini Mart is fast, he can play almost any position on the field, a switch hitter, and he’s young. They his versatility and speed on the bench. Would like to see him bunt a little.

    The Dipsy

  24. Pat Gallen

    January 26, 2012 at 8:25 am

    After reading through the comments, I think the feeling here is that the Phillies can equal value on a player for much cheaper. Valdez was set to make almost a $1MM this season. You can find a player on a replacement level much like Valdez at a minimum contract or steal them on a minor league deal. If Amaro waits (which he is not prone to do), he might be able to find a veteran willing to try and latch on.

    We have a soft spot for Valdez because he was one of our own, the 19inning game, he was a solid defender. But lets face it, he wasn’t an above average player. I think the Phillies knew that and would rather not spend the $930K on him. If you can save that $500K and get a guy at a minimum, you do it.

    I wrote initially on my roster projections post that I didn’t think he would be here because there are too many guys, even in the minors, like him. I stand by that. I thank Wilson for his time here. He had some pretty cool moments and helped out in a pinch. But he is what he is and he was expendable.

    • delearyous

      January 27, 2012 at 4:59 pm

      very well put pat. why not get something out of valdez if he was fighting for his roster spot anyway. no one wants galvis, martinez, or orr right now, so give them a chance

  25. schmenkman

    January 26, 2012 at 8:36 am

    Miles, Theriot and Miggy are not upgrades over Valdez. As recently as 2009, yes. But their stats over the last two years are virtually identical:

    Valdez .254/.300/.351 (.285 wOBA), -3 fielding runs
    Theriot .270/.321/.325 (.289 wOBA), -10 fielding runs
    Tejada .259/.298/.362 (.289 wOBA), -3 fielding runs
    Miles .277/.313/.339 (.287 wOBA), -4 fielding runs

    Ages in 2012 will be 34, 32, 38, and 35 respectively.

    Renteria looks better over the last two years, but has been trending down, so it’s not clear he would be much better offensively. Also, he’s been almost exclusively a shortstop, but could probably fill in effectively at second and third.

    Renteria .262/.318/.360 (.301 wOBA), +3 fielding runs

    • Don M

      January 26, 2012 at 9:28 am

      Which of those guys strikes out least, sacrifices the most, etc…. Because that’s the type of bat we should be adding .. Somebody that can grind a pitcher and at least be productive, even if it’s an out .. Strikeouts and failure to move runners kills this offense at times

      • schmenkman

        January 26, 2012 at 10:06 am

        I assume you know they had the 2nd fewest Ks in the league. You must be talking about situational hitting and “productive outs”

      • Don M

        January 26, 2012 at 12:20 pm

        Yea, off the bench, late in a game.. A guy that can work a pitcher an do something to help this team, instead of help the pitcher.. Maybe I don’t see Theriot enough but from what I’ve seen of him before he fouls off tough pitches and makes pitchers work by not chasing etc.. Small sample size based on the eye test so if someone really is better than him at that, I’d switch my vote for who I want (from Ruben’s comments in Jay’s interview, it sounds to me that they still like Martinez for a bench job) I know people are knocking his “speed” the guy has a 25-steal season in high-A ball and then a 23-steal season split between AA and AAA.. So maybe he’s it the fastest guy in the world but he’s got some speed apparently

    • Manny

      January 26, 2012 at 11:20 am

      Renteria is the man for the job!

  26. Chuck A.

    January 26, 2012 at 8:39 am

    Pat, I agree we have a “soft spot ” for him. Plus, he came in right on the heels of Eric Bruntlett so it’s natural to think that he’s pretty special because, compared to Bruntlett, he was light years better. But, thinking about it from the business side, I get the move to shed salary. Just hope it pans out, that’s all…

  27. psujoe

    January 26, 2012 at 12:21 pm

    The Howard contract certainly looks a lot better now.

    Fielder vs Howard

    2012 23-20
    2013 23-20
    2014 24-25
    2015 24-25
    2016 24-23 option 10 mil buyout
    2017,2018,2019, 2020 24 mil for Fielder

    Howard’s contract is superior. $5 million less over 6 years and a $10 lifeline to get out after 5 years.

    • Manny

      January 26, 2012 at 5:13 pm

      Howard is declining… and FAST. I’m pretty sure we haven’t seen the worst yet. If you visualize a 2014+ version of Howard, ugh. I don’t wanna go there.

      • schmenkman

        January 26, 2012 at 6:05 pm

        Well, his OPS+ over the last 4 years: 124, 141, 127, 125

        He was leading the league in RBIs and climbing in HRs when he started sitting out games for his various foot/ankle issues.

        I think the key is staying healthy. Health-issues (and therefore playing time) aside, I don’t see a huge decline yet.

  28. psujoe

    January 26, 2012 at 12:25 pm

    Oops, put the option in one year early, but you get the point

    • Jeff Dowder

      January 26, 2012 at 1:10 pm

      I guess. But as far as on field production, Fielder at ages 28-32 will out perform Howard at ages 32-36.

      • Brian Sr. of CO

        January 26, 2012 at 1:46 pm

        Gee are you sure? LOL. Fielder at ages 28-32 will out perform Howard at ages 32-36. Howard had better numbers then he has now, meaning Howard at ages 28-32 will outperform himself at ages 32-36.

    • Jeff Dowder

      January 26, 2012 at 3:08 pm

      Brian – Prince will perform better than Howard over the next five seasons. Yes, I’m sure. We’ll compare their respective numbers after the 2016 season.

  29. Don M

    January 26, 2012 at 3:35 pm

    We would have to compare them after 9 years… Howard for five years and whoever replaces him and whatever their cost is for four yesrs vs Fielder for all 9 years. I would think the Phillies will get better total value from 1b over those 9 years (though many teams will get better value from their 1b then both the Phillies and the Tigers over the course of these deals)

  30. Chuck A.

    January 26, 2012 at 3:50 pm

    Prince is better than Howard but Howard is a Phillie and Prince is a Tiger. So can we all just cheer for Ryan Howard to have a productive 5-year period for us ?

    • schmenkman

      January 26, 2012 at 4:41 pm

      Absolutely. I would think we can all agree on that.

    • schmenkman

      January 26, 2012 at 4:47 pm

      On a related note, this is a short post I wrote last year on another blog, in response to Hamels being booed in his first start: http://www.thegoodphight.com/2011/4/7/2096543/coining-a-new-word

      • Don M

        January 26, 2012 at 8:38 pm

        Hahaha… Please link that often this season!!

    • Lefty

      January 26, 2012 at 7:37 pm

      schmenkman- that was funny! And yes Chuck, we will all hope for the best. I will still be critical in a rational manner when I see fit, but I have never booed a Phillies player. Therefore, apocryphal or not, I won’t lose my eye sight.

  31. Chuck A.

    January 26, 2012 at 8:01 pm

    schmenkman, if Pat gave out an award for comment of the day, you would win today. Nice!

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