Phillies Nation

49 Responses to “Gamenight: Braves (19-19) At Phillies (22-18)”

1. Bruce Says:
   May 14th, 2008 at 6:12 pm

   After Werth’s misplay in CF last night, will Manuel put him in RF tonight?

2. Mike T. Says:
   May 14th, 2008 at 6:19 pm

   Werth’s in Center — again.

3. Bruce Says:
   May 14th, 2008 at 6:21 pm

   Never mind…. found info on another site.

   Tonight’s Lineup. No change from Tuesday, except behind the plate and on the mound:
   Rollins, ss
   Victorino, rf
   Utley, 2b
   Howard, 1b
   Burrell, lf
   Werth, cf
   Feliz, 3b
   Coste, c
   Myers, p

4. Jason Says:
   May 14th, 2008 at 7:29 pm

   Myers is getting his shit ripped. Has not hit over 90 on the gun and it seems he just wants to throw all fastballs. He is a number three at best right now but in his head he is a star. With the lack of a fastball he could not even be a closer. I hope Gilick realizes the importrance of a bullpen and signs Lidge becuase Myers in the pen would not be wise.

5. Jason Says:
   May 14th, 2008 at 7:33 pm

   HOWARD RUN THE BALL OUT! I HOPE HE DOES NOT PULL HIS 10,000,000 HAMSTRINGS.

6. Jason Says:
   May 14th, 2008 at 7:39 pm

   Great Catch Howard - Seriously?

7. Greg Says:
   May 14th, 2008 at 7:57 pm

   Dude. 5 run spot? Myers is horsesh$t. Eaton is way better.

8. Greg Says:
   May 14th, 2008 at 7:58 pm

   Leave him in til he learns his GD lesson and figures out how to pitch again. I don’t care if he throws 200 pitches and gives up 15 earned runs.

9. Rob Cowie Says:
   May 14th, 2008 at 8:06 pm

   When does the Myers demotion thread start?

10. Jason Says:
    May 14th, 2008 at 8:07 pm

    If he threw 200 pitches he’d give up way more than 15 runs.

11. Mike T. Says:
    May 14th, 2008 at 8:14 pm

    Rob, it started a couple weeks ago. For the last time, get him and Howard out of here!

12. Sean Says:
    May 14th, 2008 at 8:15 pm

    myers=garbage
    howard=farbage
    wtf is happening?

13. Lewisauce Says:
    May 14th, 2008 at 8:18 pm

    Rob, see my post under the “Charlie’s explanation for Werth in center” topic. I’ll be happy to keep Myers — the second he decides to grow up.

14. Jason Says:
    May 14th, 2008 at 8:28 pm

    Watching this game has cause me to throw up in my mouth - that should be the title of the post-game report.

15. Matt Says:
    May 14th, 2008 at 8:35 pm

    I think it might be time to take a look at AJ Happ and let Myers miss a start, Barry Zito style.

16. Matt Says:
    May 14th, 2008 at 8:38 pm

    Actually, I take that back - here’s Happs line from tonight (so far)
    -

    5 IP, 7 hits, 4 runs, 2 BB, 6Ks, 2 HRs. Not awful, but it looks like he shouldn’t be called up yet.

17. Greg Says:
    May 14th, 2008 at 8:42 pm

    Rename the Jeltz Award the Myers Award!! If only we had sent HIM to Japan.

18. Mike T. Says:
    May 14th, 2008 at 8:53 pm

    HOWARD SWINGING AT THE FIRST PITCH DURING A RALLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ARE YOU SERIOUS!??!!!??!! I’M SO TIRED OF THIS GUY!!!

19. Mike T. Says:
    May 14th, 2008 at 8:54 pm

    Burrell walked on 4 — Howard didn’t even make him pitch 2 - what a moron.

20. Mike T. Says:
    May 14th, 2008 at 8:56 pm

    Mets and Marlins both in separate pitchers duels - that’s not a good sign for us.

21. Jason Says:
    May 14th, 2008 at 9:20 pm

    Taguhi not only swings on the first pitch of a new pitcher but then grounds out into a DP. I understand Manuel’s laidback but his hitters have no approach at the plate. When you are down you need base runners! Work the count and get a hitter’s pitch - not a pitchers!

22. erik Says:
    May 14th, 2008 at 9:31 pm

    yep, time to trade howard

23. Danny Says:
    May 14th, 2008 at 9:32 pm

    Ryan’s going to catch fire. Frustrating game. If only Myers didn’t suck, we would be in this thing. Damn.

24. Jason Says:
    May 14th, 2008 at 9:33 pm

    erik, if the Phillies do not win this game it is a meaningless HR. But where were you when Howard DROPPED the DP Ball from Utley? Or when he swung at the first pitch during the rally? Explain those to me.

25. Danny Says:
    May 14th, 2008 at 9:35 pm

    Personally, I was out smoking meth

26. erik Says:
    May 14th, 2008 at 9:41 pm

    ok i will give you the dp ball, big mistake i agree. however, swinging first pitch fastball during a rally seems like a good idea to me. he missed it, that happens it is a normal part of baseball(hence why nobody has ever hit .500) people ground out. if he smacks that one for a hit, it is a completely different story. he is up there to hit, not walk

27. Mike T. Says:
    May 14th, 2008 at 9:44 pm

    No, you make the pitcher pitch during a rally. He’s already frustrated that he gave up those runs, his location is beginning to run, his arm strength is weakening - you make him pitch, no questions asked.

28. erik Says:
    May 14th, 2008 at 9:49 pm

    yes there are questions asked, so howard watches the pitch go by, probably fouls off the next one and he is down 0-2. we all know what happens then. i would rather see him swinging than watching pitches going by and getting himself into an ugly count. but then again, this site should be called antihowardnation.com because that is all anybody wants to seem to talk about. i have not read one thing about the president of the USA saying that if he could take one player it would be utley. way to much negativity on this website. i see myself playing devils advocate and trying to be a positive thinker. excuse me if i try to see the glass as half full

29. chris m Says:
    May 14th, 2008 at 10:01 pm

    im taking out my frusteration ouut right now…myers fuckings blows…howard sucks…..and every1 lets victorino off but he lost thins fucking game that stu[id son of a bitch

30. Geoff Says:
    May 14th, 2008 at 10:10 pm

    On a side note…everybody likes victorino but hes kind of average isnt he? at least i think so. hes fast but hes not a very good hitter right now. im positive when i think they have enough players to win. i felt good about the flyers, they had enough to win before coburn and timonen got hurt. with this team, i need more pitching. i just do. then ill brighten up a bit.

    I love the rally they made at the end of the game.

    but I have seen enough of brett myers. its time to get him on out of here and get whatever you can squeeze out of it for him. he gave up 8 runs!!!!!! technically. thats terrible. either get him out of here or zito him and make him a junk reliever.

31. Geoff Says:
    May 14th, 2008 at 10:23 pm

    Ill tell you what happened. during the offseason they touted the lidge myers move and acted like they didnt need to do anything else because theyre the greatest team in the nl with brett myers in the rotation. granted, lidge has been basically unhittable so far. but they didnt do anything else in terms of pitching!!! a few minor moves in the lineup and the pen and thats it. they took a HUGE risk and a wreckless gamble going with this starting rotation. brett myers is your opening day starter? whaaaaaaat? moyer is the 3? whaaaat? they need more innings eaters in the middle of the rotation and they need a stud to send out after hamels in the 2 slot. brett myers isnt the one so thats why i say that. ive seen enough from myers, time to go jackass! if he doesnt want to go through the preparation it takes to be a professional athlete then i dont want him on this team

32. Greg Says:
    May 15th, 2008 at 12:15 am

    Geoff, your rants about starting pitching are never-ending, but SPs weren’t exactly growing on trees in the off-season. You want to lock yourself up throwing another 8.25 M at another bum in Carlos Silva? Lohse as a last minute pickup may have been a good investment, but he was way over-priced all off-season and is certainly coming back to Earth after a good start. What is another 5.00 ERA guy going to get us?

    Our SP shortage is more a factor of lack of available talent, the lesson learned from the Eaton debacle, and no serviceable MLB-ready talent to employ or trade away in the minors. Its real easy to GM when your hindsight is 20/20, and for all the talk of the Phils cheapskate ownership, the one player that was a great fit for the team was Lowell and they outbid everyone, but to no avail. The patchwork was the next best option.

    I do agree that expectations may have been on the high side for Myers, but who could forsee this? He IS a career 4 ERA guy.

33. Mark Says:
    May 15th, 2008 at 2:47 am

    Brett Myers’ performance — downright ugly! He either struck guys out (he recorded 6 strikeouts in his 4 1/3 innings) or got pounded.

34. Mike T. Says:
    May 15th, 2008 at 7:26 am

    He (Myers) is 7-7 with a 4.91 ERA in 27 career appearances against Washington.* You can’t really start this guy… can you?

    *MLB.com

35. OZ Says:
    May 15th, 2008 at 8:13 am

    can Sav Rocca pitch?

36. Gavin Says:
    May 15th, 2008 at 8:46 am

    As for Howard and Taguci’s approach at the plate. Just taking a pitch to take a pitch is not wise unless you are confident that you can hit with two strikes (Chase, JRoll) If you are struggling, you need to hit the pitch that is in the zone you’re looking for…..if that happens to be the first pitch so be it. If it is a reliever, and he just came in the game, its best to take a couple of pitches, time him up.

    As for Myers, we’re just going to have to endure him working through it, just like Howard. he’s proven he can be dominant in the bigs….so I think they will just have him work it out. As painful as it is for us.

    As for the negativity……this is a blog….and most of us use this as an outlet to vent, So it is what it is. Chill. I agree that its almost always negative….me included….but thats the fun of it.

37. Geoff Says:
    May 15th, 2008 at 8:49 am

    there are plenty of numbers i could thrtow out here. like the fact that they spend 10 million less than they claim they do, this year and last year. or the fact that their farm system is ranked 22nd.

    most teams have the ability to put someone from the minors in their rotation and have it work every year or if theres no room, then use them in a trade.

    what it comes down to is they DID go and make a carlos silva signing when they signed adam eaton. you cant throw money at that junk, so youre right there. carlos silva got 11mm per year! thats insane. freddy garcia’s injury killed them too. if those two things work out then they have plenty of pitching. thats gillicks fault for not doing his homework.

    they can be like, oh were not cheap we spent money: yeah, but do you spend it wisely? there is no excuse for not adding lohse to the back end of your rotation though for that cut rate of 4mm. they made one good move this offseason. they needed to make one more (trade probably) and add number 2 starter. thats what they need to go deep into the playoffs (assuming everyone else is healthy). they also need someone else to stabilize the back end of the rotation. yes that all costs money (at least the 10mm they lied about spending) and yes they dont grow on trees. but if you want them you can get them.

    also, its time for myers to go close for some team in the AL, because ive seen enough

38. Geoff Says:
    May 15th, 2008 at 8:50 am

    yes, AGREED! blogs are for venting post-loss anger so your friends or family dont think you are crazy.

39. Mike T. Says:
    May 15th, 2008 at 9:18 am

    That being said: WE ARE NOT A GOOD BASEBALL TEAM RIGHT NOW.

40. Don M Says:
    May 15th, 2008 at 9:37 am

    What everyone needs realize… and I’ve been saying this for a week or so now… that NO TEAM IN MAJOR LEAGUE BASEBALL is going to give up ” and ACE, or a #2″ for anything that the Phillies have.

    If you were another GM… would you give up young top pitching prospects, or an established #2 for Ryan Howard or Brett Myers??

    Eaton was a bad signing, but considering what Silva, Vicente Padilla, etc… get per year, its not that bad. The key to winning right now is developing your farm system through trades and draft…. not trading away your system for stars (ala Yankees).

    I really think that they need to decide that Brett Myers is a closer, not a starter… and sell that idea to a team that needs a Closer. Get what you can for the guy and def by next year Carrasco is in the rotation, maybe see what happens with Savery, Outman and those guys

41. Geoff Says:
    May 15th, 2008 at 9:52 am

    good points. carrasco is up for a spot start in september to see what he can do. hes in the rotation next year. id disagree in that you could get a good number two out of somebody. aces you have to develop on your own no right minded team would give up an ace unless they were salary dumping. maybe you can call up one of those teams that doesnt try to win and get a number two from them. baltimore comes to mind once they lose some more games. there are some guys out there that are in their walk years. you can grab one of those guys (burnett, maybe) and theyd be an upgrade over what they currently have in the 3 or 4 slots. i only approve of that thoguh if you can resign the guy to an extension. i hate doing that.

    its like the marian hossa thing. the penguins wont be able to keep him, so if they dont win the cup they gave up a bunch of guys for no rings

    by the way, you gotta like the rays stepping up to the plate and signing their top two starters long-term. good for them. who did the mets give up kazmir for anyway? i dont remember. couldnt have been a good trade.

42. Don M Says:
    May 15th, 2008 at 10:21 am

    Just for the sake of it…. who is a #2 that you would want, and think that there is any chance you might be able to get in a trade…..without giving up something from the farm.

    ???

43. Mike T. Says:
    May 15th, 2008 at 10:24 am

    Speaking of stepping it up, the Marlins signed Hanley Ramirez to a gigantic contract. I can’t remember the last time Florida signed someone long-term. That’s good to see, I’m tired of big market teams hogging all the talent just because small market teams can’t afford to pay them.

44. Mike T. Says:
    May 15th, 2008 at 10:24 am

    Daniel Cabrera for Madson and Myers.

45. Don M Says:
    May 15th, 2008 at 10:29 am

    Burnett is OK… and Cabrera from Baltimore is OK…. But I think Burnett makes a ton of money now, and is a free agent in the next year or two? I dont know how much either of them really help your team

46. Don M Says:
    May 15th, 2008 at 10:33 am

    Cabrera isn’t as good as Myers.. If Myers was a full time Closer, he’d be a top-10 Clocer in the league… that’s how they have to package him. Like the Oakland A’s when Billy Beene first started running the show there.. they realize that almost anyone can be a closer, because earning a save is one of the easiest things to do in the game…. with your team winning by as many as 3 runs, to not allow the other team to win…. the average pitcher will succeed in that role more than not. But not every team buys into that… the teams that don’t… maybe the Brewers?? they need a closer… If the Yankees decide to put Joba in a starter role, they’ll need a setup man and eventual successor to Mariano Rivera

47. Bruce Says:
    May 15th, 2008 at 11:03 am

    Mike T’s broken record…..”We are not a good team…” etc. (chuckle)

    Question: If the Phillies (22-19) are “not a good team”, what team is in the NL East Division at this moment?

48. Geoff Says:
    May 15th, 2008 at 11:20 am

    If you can take on the extra money while replacing eaton with burnett or cabrera you do it. without giving up too much. the phillies wont do that though.

    Also…again, we see this all around the league now: the brewers just signed ryan braun to a 7 year extension. this is what you have to do. the rays signed kazmir and shields longterm.

    its really dangerous to meddle with arbitration with people like hamels and howard. they get really ticked off and it messesd up their mental approach (with howard). if i were a gm id see someone like hamels, look at the going rate for someone like him (fausto carmona) and tweak it and then offer him the deal. thats what every other GM does and gillick did with utley and jimmy. its all about buying out arb years and FA years. to their credit, chase utley is a bargain right now because they locked him up long term.

    i like what bean has done with his team. they suffered for a while but he got rid of a lot of overpaid junk for primo prospects. although dan haren isnt junk of course, they just got an offer they couldnt refuse. Brett Myers as the Yankees closer post-rivera? interesting…

    I agree that if the guy isnt horrible, he can close. Now, if youre a very good pitcher, you can be a lights out closer. Id make two rotation moves. First, Id take myers and sell him as a closer to someone that needs one. I see a lot of teams on the mlb stats list that have too many blown saves. Basically, if a team doesnt have a top 10 closer then theyd be interested in myers. You trade them myers plus a prospect or adding madson is a good idea and you take a number 2 guy in return. Blanton eats innings but the A’s wouldnt do that. Baltimore would take it with cabrera (he is better than our number 3 so id take him). id take burnett and try to extend his deal for 3 years if he stays healthy down the stretch. i dont care about their self-imposed salary cap. im trying to win here… id also go out and get a starter to solidify the back end of the rotation and replace adam eaton. im not counting on benson, if he can help us thats fine.

    there are some other guys as well but i have to end my mid-morning break and get back to work.

49. Don M Says:
    May 15th, 2008 at 11:56 am

    ***I don’t care about their self-imposed salary cap. I’m trying to win here*** With that thought process we should have picked up Johan Santana…traded everything we have for Miguel Cabrere and Dontrelle Willis… or Dan Haren….

    The point is there are moves that people would love to do, but you have to be realistic… 2 years ago everyone wanted Barry Zito… look how well that turned out. I really like the Phillie stance of not going too long on a deal for a pitcher, as a fan it sucks, but as fans that really know the sport, we have to realize what is better for the team.

    Like all the morons that wanted the Phillies to pay Howard $20 million this year… WHY? They have him under control for the next few years…making $10 million a year is more than enough for the ryan K howard. Same thing with Hamels… lets see this guy win 18-20 games, stay healthy for a year, and then worry about overpaying him…

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