Little Offense, Lowly Madson Foil Phils’ Sweep

Posted by Tim Malcolm, Fri, August 22, 2008 09:07 AM

With nobody out in the eighth inning, Jayson Werth stood on third base and Chase Utley led off first. Ryan Howard stepped to the plate and struck out. Then within seconds, Pat Burell erased himself and Utley from the scorecard, ending the inning.

That’s the story of the year, right there, clear as day, and the crucial misfire in a 4-3 loss to the Nationals. It snapped the Nats’ 13-game losing streak, dropped the Phillies into a 2.5-game hole in the NL East and put a really long sigh at the beginning of a really tough stretch.

Earlier in the series we grazed by the offense’s deficiencies because, hey, they were winning. This time you can’t do it. Getting only three runs off Nationals pitching via a Chase Utley single, a Greg Dobbs groundout and a Carlos Ruiz home run, they came up lame late when they really needed it. Howard is the major culprit, going 0-or-4 with three strikeouts. Jimmy Rollins also had a bad game, going 0-for-4. (In the ninth, they had Shane Victorino on second with no outs, and of course, couldn’t score him.)

Ryan Madson blew the save with a four-hit barrage in the eighth, netting two Washington runs. It seems once he pulls together a string of great performances, he falls hard with a bad one. Maybe it was foreseeable, but you can’t blame putting him into the game in the eighth.

On the good news front, Jamie Moyer continued to lower his ERA with a fine performance. He gave up just two earned runs on five hits while walking three. His ERA is now 3.54.

It’s a shame the bullpen couldn’t hold it, but you have to think the Phils can score more runs against the Nationals. Then again, it’s the story of the year – this offense really isn’t that good.

Associated Press photo

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95 Responses to “Little Offense, Lowly Madson Foil Phils’ Sweep”

  1. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 9:16 am

    What were all of you saying the beginning of the year? “our offense is so good it doesnt matter if we get more pitching or not.”

    i said: “you cant rely on that all year, what if its not there?”

    noone knew theyd be this bad, but thats what happens when you use one thing as a crutch for too long.

  2. P. Pig Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 9:24 am

    That’s all folks!

  3. Bear Mike Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 9:29 am

    OK, the Phillies are extremely frustrating to watch anymore. However, Jamie is always a treat to watch. Precision and finess is his recipe for success this year. Kudos to “The Old Man on the Hill”! (sounds like a book he could write).

    Cholly needs to start managing this team! Start playing base to base offense!Example: Bot 8th Ryan “I can’t hit a Fn’ fastball in the heart of the plate” Howard at the plate. No outs, Werth on second, Utley on first. Dude, I’m calling a double steal. Worse case Werth gets banged at third base leaving Utley at second with one out. Or how about a really risky call and bunt Howard in that situation? Jesus, do something instead of sitting back and let our base runners rot on the bases. Shake up the opposing defense by keeping them on pins and needles! Cholly needs to really start playing aggressive baseball because his approach is clearly not working!

    I would shake up the line-up for a few games:

    * Rollins needs to move way down in the line-up (WTF is up with him????)

    * Although I really like him in the six hole, Vic goes to lead off (Flat-out awesome this year – all heart & hustle!)

    * Burrell to clean-up and “Howard The K” to the 5 hole to K there.

    Go Phillies!!!!!!

  4. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 9:31 am

    victorino has been their only consistent threat all year on the basepads.

  5. John Cena Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 9:31 am

    Batisia was 3 seconds better then me # DAM SECONDS BETTER THEN ME …. but that was but that was on SUnday the 17th. That will not happen again as the chain gain leader will win the belt back at unforgiven for my fans here in Philly. YOU CANT SEE ME!!!

  6. Mark Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 9:32 am

    Phillies pitching has been a revelation; starting, relieving and of course closing. With the way the offense has collapsed since mid-June, anything less form the pitching and the Phillies would be pushing up daisies like Pittsburgh or Washington, not contending for the Division.

    Last night was another p— poor offensive performance. Charlie, do something, wake them up, impose fines, do something!

  7. Paul Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 9:33 am

    You said it perfectly. That is really poor when you can’t get clutch and score a runner from 3rd with less than 2 outs. That is something you have to do to be a contending club.

    Bummer too, the pitching as a whole has been solid. But you just can’t trust the hitting to get it done right now.

    Heck, I got worried when the Phils fell behind 1-0. And that tells you something…

  8. Don M Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 9:33 am

    John Cena is right on lol

  9. John Cena Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 9:34 am

    Your time is up my time is now you cant see me my time is now

  10. John Cena Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 9:34 am

    Who here wants tp have a rap battle?

  11. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 9:36 am

    they cant see the ball right, i know that. maybe they need contact lenses, all of them.

  12. Matt Kwasiborski Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 9:43 am

    What in the good Lord’s name is going on with this team? Their offense is looking like it did when Bowa was managing. I mean, they are tightening up in key situations like they did before Manuel became the manager. And this team is way better and their pitching has been tremendous this year. Mark said it best, our pitching is what is keeping us afloat.

    Injuries aren’t an exuse but Utley has looked awful since April, Rollins definitely is not 100% and his comments are the reason our hitters are tightening up. Howard is so impatient- I mean he would be hitting .360 if he could excerise some plate discipline.

    Outside of the lack of hitting, the other problem I have with last night is using Madson in the set up role. This guy has proved time and time again he does not have the head to pitch in key situations. He is a 6th or 7th inning guy, not a set up guy, not a closer and not a starter. You put Madson in the game, especially at home, when you are up by at least 3 runs or mop up duty. I mean Chad Durbin has proven all year he can set up and he should be the 8th inning guy along with Romero. Madson, like Gavin Floyd will never succeed here because they don’t have the head or heart to perform in Philly.

    These next 23 games will determine where we are. And I praised the Phils for not giving in to Rowand’s demand of a fourth or fifth year, but I am not eating crow on that one too. His leadership is not replaceable.

  13. TJ Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 9:45 am

    Is Ryan Howard still alive? I usually just see Burrell walk up after Utley and an extra out is magically on the scoreboard. Thank god that Howard is getting it done on defense.. waittttttttt

  14. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 9:46 am

    hahah. thats so true. it happens with rollins too. when i estimate the commericials are over i flip back to the channel and theres ALREADY one out.

  15. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 9:48 am

    how do they not blast hanrahan too? that guy just hurls junk in the general direction of the plate. half the time it doesnt get there. except with this team.

  16. NJ Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 9:48 am

    Come on don’t be too hard on Madson here, as I said weeks ago unless the offense starts producing or at the very least hitting consistently every poor pitching performance would be magnafied… And it has.

    I hate to say it because he’s such a nice figurehead but Charlie’s not the guy, he’s back where he was at in Cleveland not being able to coax out of his team that extra level needed to compete for a championship. I’m not one of those who believe we have a right to win every year but I hate to see this team piss away their opportunity to compete at the top because they clearly won’t commit off the field to what it takes to take your game to that added level on the field.

  17. ped Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 9:49 am

    hopefully tonight’s lineup will have Shane leading off with Rollins batting 7th. In fact, I would sit j-roll for a game. Maybe switch up ryan and pat in the order.

    Does anyone else have zero confidence in kendrick all of sudden?

  18. TJ Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 9:50 am

    This team has no excuses for the way its been playing. I hate Milt Thompson right now if it is him to blame for the hitting but I think its the players honestly, all about themselves at the plate,

    “let me swing for the fences all the time so I can bask in the glory of these fans cheering me, If I dont get a hit, it doesnt matter because I’m an all star…. YEAHHHHHHHH” – The approach of Ryan Howard

  19. TJ Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 9:52 am

    Does anyone else have zero confidence in kendrick all of sudden?

    I have confidence in him, hes pretty good until his recent three starts.

  20. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 9:52 am

    i would force j-roll to watch eric bruntlett strike out and commit errors in his place for two or three games, especially if it costs them the game and places in teh standings. something HAS to get through to him eventually.

  21. TJ Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 9:54 am

    Past success means abso-fucking-lutely nothing in a playoff race like this and these players winning MVPs was the worst thing to happen to them because they think they have done enough to do whatever the fuck they want. Interesting arbitration coming up for Howard.

  22. TJ Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 9:56 am

    Geoff, or Rollins would be like “see, a half ass me is better than him trying” and still continue to get out and pretend to be frustrated by blowing bubbles with his gum and shake his head like the ump swung and missed for him.

  23. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:02 am

    exactly, they both win MVP awards and then act like its a real accomplishment. mvp awards are like two or three levels above being named to the all star team. the only thing that really matters is long term production over your career, and of course, championships. and hall of fame of course but those two will only see the hall of fame as tourists at this rate.

  24. Don M Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:11 am

    First of all… its beat to come on here and see that John Cena is now also posting under “Don M”… and using the phrase “lol”..

    2nd… It wasn’t too long ago that people were suggesting that Victorino be traded and stuff… Its clear that Victorino is now the spark-plug that Rollins was last year, so he needs to bat at the top in order to get that one-extra at bat.

    Last night’s comments had a certain frequent poster. calling for the Phillies to get rid of Ryan Madson.. which is a joke cause Madson has been solid all year..

    AND.. I guess we don’t want Moyer to retire now because he would make a good coach?

    AND number 2.. Hanrahan was hitting 97mph on the gun, with a nasty slider in the dirt.. throwing hard, I thought that was what you looked for in a pitcher???

  25. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:15 am

    it is. but it was in the dirt. dont swing at it…

  26. Joe Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:18 am

    I am working from a small sample here, but in my 15 years as a Phillies fan (moved here in ‘93), I have never attended a game like last night’s game where the stands are full and there is so much tension between the crowd and the players. Jimmy Rollins and Ryan Howard got treated with the boos and derision like Pat Burrell used to hear before every at bat in previous seasons. They looked (from my far away terrace seats) uncomfortable, and their play was sure tight and lousy.

    I attended games in the mid-90s, in a Vet so empty they didn’t bother opening concessions above the 500 level. That was a different kind of “frontrunner” problem.

    I guess Rollins identified a real problem at the same time that he exacerbated it.

  27. NJ Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:19 am

    Come on Lidge has made a career out of that nasty slider in the dirt. Hanrahan has been talked over very highly he’s not like Redding/Bergmann who’s exceeded expectations, he’s thought to be legit.

  28. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:20 am

    ryan madson is trash.

  29. NJ Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:24 am

    Come on Geoff his ERA had been sub 3.50 for the last two years, he’s not an elite reliever and doesn’t have nasty stuff but he’s pretty good. Who would you prefer? Do you think we should have added Gagne or Cordero and then trade for Street and go after K-Rod this year…?

  30. Don M Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:26 am

    You are trash.. you’ve wanted Moyer to retire, and Madson with a 3.38 ERA to be DFA’d ..

    Try be happy for what you have instead of steadily calling for replacements..

  31. Don M Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:27 am

    Geoff wants All-Stars at every position. …every one except SS, he doesn’t like that All-Star, so he’d rather go with Jason Donald..

  32. bull Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:30 am

    manual and milt need to be taken behind the woodshed and wake up…what they put out there for a lineup has to change…
    werth
    utley
    burrell
    howard
    vic
    rollins
    feliz
    catcher
    pitcher

    werth will at least work the pitcher so i think he should lead off over vic let vic keep lighting it up down bottom

  33. Don M Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:31 am

    no possible way they put their two best baserunners in the 6-7 spots.. I would be fine with Victorino leading off.. and trying Rollins down in the 6-hole.

    In fact, I wouldn’t be surprised if Manuel tries that soon.. But they won’t move the entire lineup around at the same time

  34. christopher Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:32 am

    madson is a very good piece to your bullpen, he’s just not a set up guy. i disagree with whoever said you put him in when you lead by at least 3 too, he’s fine in closer games than that, just not in the 8th inning. the defense is what lost them last night’s game. even though they didn’t give him an error on it, jroll should have had that play that lead to the nats tying it. if he isn’t going to contribute anything offensively, then he needs to be spectacular defensively. also utley’s god awful throw earlier cost them another run.

  35. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:32 am

    ok chiefs, how about you use madson as a 6th/7th innings guy..hes not a setup man. they dont have a true setup man and they needed to get one at the deadline…oops…

  36. Greg B Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:36 am

    Why is it so outrageous to ask Howard to bunt in that situation? Wasn’t it Werth on 2nd and Utley on 1st? He drops a bunt and the 80% chance that he Ks, pops up, or GIDPs is gone. I mean, what are you hoping for? Werth is on second, so a fly out does no good.

    I’m tired of these sluggers getting coddled and being “above” situational baseball. We’re down one run and Howard is incapable of a productive out. Not to mention he was 0-6 w/ 5Ks against Hanrahan. Make that an even half dozen, now. I usually let Charlie manage the game, but something needed to be done in that situation.

  37. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:37 am

    id try batting victorino leadoff and batting rollins on the waiver-wire with all th eother trash.

  38. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:38 am

    i will galdly and freely admit i was wrong about shane. he looked lost until charlie straightened him out beacuse HE LISTENED. now hes their best player.

  39. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:38 am

    go get me ian kinsler and move him to shortstop.

  40. NJ Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:40 am

    Set up man at the deadline… Hmmm… Fuentes? Street? Mahay? Sherril? Marte? Only one was traded and the Yanks had to pull off a big deal to get him included. You can’t critisise a bullpen near the very best this year, the set-up tandems being used were as good as a solution as there was going to be.

  41. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:42 am

    its not bad but another good, solid arm would really have made this bullpen insanely awesome.

    phil…ive been reaidng the watchmen whenever i get a little time, and youre right man, wow. thats really better than a lot of standard books. its so deep and esoteric.

  42. Don M Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:43 am

    He’s their best player right now… but he’s not their best player overall… you’ll call for him to be traded or something soon too, i’ll put money on it.

    They should get A-rod and move him to catcher too, and get Brandon Webb and make him your 8th inning guy..

    All this stuff stays in my head, like eventhough nobody thinks we have a good bullpen, everyone wanted them to trade guys from their bullpen for Pudge.. you can’t get everything you want… because to aquire those things, you need to give things up..

  43. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:44 am

    im just a big fan of kinsler, i think that guys great and is only going to get better…untouchable obviously

  44. NJ Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:45 am

    Shane’s not our best player, he’s our most consistent. I’m not apose to a new FO trading either Rollins or Howard to make a statement to the clubhouse that no-one is above the team but it’s going to take a major deal with likely no trade partners.

    Kinsler at short? Do you just make this stuff up for fun… Firstly how the hell we would get Kinsler? Come on propose a practical deal that doesn’t destroy the farm that the Rangers would take… While your at it do you want to propose a deal for Braun? Pujols? Why not future starts in Price or LaPorta?

  45. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:45 am

    victorino? no, why? hes cheap even with arbitration and hes the ONLY guy who looks liek theyre trying out there. hes untouichable right now.

  46. Eb Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:45 am

    Why cant Cholly let Durbin pitch more then 1 inning??? I bullpen is gased

  47. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:46 am

    dude, im half kidding with kinsler. relax. i just think that guys awesome. id give them jimmy for him and then reshuffle the infield abit. but itll never happen. theyd laugh if you offered them jimmy for ian kinsler.

  48. bull Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:47 am

    first it is 5th and 6th and werth and utley are not too shabby on the base paths and we concede howard will K so vic will basically be leading off with rollins batting 2nd…plus get them running in the bottom half of the lineup so GIDP cant do his thing and we can try and turn the lineup over more often…

    p.s. if you can’t get on base (rollins .091) baserunning skills are non existent

  49. NJ Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:47 am

    Nicely said Don, you forgot Santana as the closer, trading and re-signing Holliday in left and for Mauer to play 3rd and McCann to go behind the plate.

  50. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:52 am

    exactly bull..something ive tried to explain before but don does not understand.

  51. Eb Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:52 am

    Don M…A lot of people wanted to trade Victorino for front line pitching. A stance I still agree with to an extent. However that pitcher would have to be dominate. Also I agree with you Mad Dog has been solid, everyone screws up and he screwed up last night.

    I heard A-Rod is a Catcher “wink wink”

  52. Don M Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:55 am

    Yea but if you turn the lineup over more often, wouldn’t you rather have Victorino getting an extra chance to do something each game than Werth??

    Even when Rollins was getting on base, the Marlins series in particular.. people were still bashing him.. I’ve agreed 100% that he isn’t hustling like he was last year.. but the fact that people don’t even want him on the team anymore blows my mind..

  53. Richie Allen Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:56 am

    Im with you Don M….Everybody wants everything now..every loss is a freakin tragedy…and we should trade our whole team for Manny

  54. bull Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 10:59 am

    the only change is really switching rollins and werth and i think werth has been better clutch than rollins right now and no, because as it has been noted many times vic is one of the worst hitters in the clutch this year, take the pressure off him drop him down the lineup and let him get his head together…because in all honesty he is what makes the team go and if he does not get back on track season over…

  55. NJ Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:01 am

    We shouldn’t be aposed to trading either Werth or Victorino. Vic has a lot of value down to his controllability and we could address greater needs similarly to how Tampa addressed theirs by trading Young.

  56. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:02 am

    because he doesnt want to be on the team..

  57. NJ Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:04 am

    How’s about?

    Vic
    Werth
    Rollins (would love to drop to 7 but logical place)
    Utley
    Burrell
    Howard
    Feliz
    Ruiz
    Kendrick

  58. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:04 am

    young has been a huge flop…but he was younger and less predictable. bad trade by the twins there.

  59. NJ Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:07 am

    Youngs an immature player with a fair bit of upside, once he hits his mid twenties he could be a more dominant version of Rios but he is immature and doesn’t look like he’s commited to development.

  60. Don M Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:13 am

    Victorino’s name was being thrown out there for ANY pitching help… obviously he’s not going to get you a huge return.. but people were mentioning him and saying that Werth could play CF everyday..

    Vic was mentioned in that Brian Fuentes rumor.. and he was rumored to be going to Texas all last year for Gagne, or that dude Otsuka … thank god that didnt make that deal

    Rollins is SLIGHTLY behind his career OBP%.. he’s at .326, instead of .331 (last year .344) But his stolen bases are on-pace for similar numbers, you guys act like he’s the worst player in Phillies history, when he’s actually one of the best..

  61. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:13 am

    The mets really robbed washington of church and schnieder too. theyre older, yeah, but milledge is like lost int he DC abyss there.

  62. NJ Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:18 am

    Rollins isn’t a bad player at all but his attitude is suspect and that’s effecting his performance. He’s lucky to have his numbers where they’re at this year as his approach at the plate has been aweful.

  63. Don M Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:20 am

    Phillies were interested in Church two years ago… and we ALL know that 90% of the people on here would have bitched and complained if they brought him in..

    A lot of Werth-Victorino comes down to them resigning Burrell or not… I think they could play Werth everyday in LF, with Victorino in CF…

    Werth playing everyday would have numbers around, .275 avg with 30 HR, 90+ RBIs, 90+ Runs, 20+ Stolen Bases….

    Instead of paying Burrell $15 Million..

  64. NJ Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:21 am

    The Nats weren’t robbed Church wasn’t expected to be as good as he was and Schnieder’s not a great catcher, he’s decent but he’s not in the Pudge/Varitek league.

  65. Don M Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:21 am

    before I get bashed for those numbers… figuring an everyday LF would get around 500 atbats.. so I looked at his numbers 2007+2008.. and rounded them out to realistic figures

  66. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:22 am

    then you have to bring in a RF whos above league average for cheaper than it would be to keep burrell….im not opposed to that. but i think they HAVE to keep burrell unless theyre going to get creative. creative = acquiring RF moving werth to LF etc and shuffling a bit.

  67. NJ Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:25 am

    They try to get creative and they’ll end up wtih Jenkin’s part 2 after coming up short to prize away an all-star which probably would have been the wrong move anyway, LF should be the easiest position to replace which is why every decent hitter prospect with poor defense is being converted to LF.

  68. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:28 am

    the indians already moved matt laporta to LF

  69. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:28 am

    Jenkins was the reason why i get mad at them. typical example. liek eaton, POINTLESS. no reason at all to do that.

  70. Don M Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:29 am

    If Golson didn’t K so much, they would have a great outfield soon… ? in LF, Golson in CF, Victorino in RF.. sure would cover a ton of ground out there..

    That the thing though Geoff… that stuff is SOOOOOO much easier said than done.. and then when they don’t do it, you think they its because they have the worst GM in history.

    If there are outfielders that are above league average, but cheaper than Burrell… wouldn’t teams be more interested in him than they are in Burrell… which would then drive his price up and make him more expensive..

    They’ve tried to add guys they thought could contribute.. Werth was a great pickup.. Jenkins isn’t hitting like they thought he would, but for a platoon outfielder, there aren’t a whole ton of better options

  71. Don M Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:31 am

    LF is the least demanding spot defensively in baseball.. which is why Soriano, Manny, etc.. play out there.

    I honestly think that Werth could play there everyday, and you wouldn’t miss Burrell that much.. If you can get Pat to stay for $30 M, 3 years.. Im in favor of it.. but his price is going to go up because there aren’t many RH power bats around

  72. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:31 am

    right. thats the issue: is it easier just to keep burrell? or will it end up being nearly as expensive if not in price, in cost to acquire that player via trade…

  73. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:32 am

    those are decisions i dotn feel safe allowing ruben amaro to make.

  74. Don M Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:34 am

    You know what.. Jenkins is a career .275 hitter, who usually got 25 HR and 90 RBIs… as a platoon player, you have to expect him to only reach about half of those numbers..

    If he ends the years with 12-15 HR, and 40+ RBIs.. we can’t really complain that much. His average is down, but like we’ve established on here before, its nearly impossible for a guy to get into any kind of offensive groove when he only plays every 3rd game..

  75. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:38 am

    i just think its an example of them thinking that anybody whos had decent career numbers will magically hit 30 hr and drive in 100 rbi because theyre playing in CBP so they go for HR or K hitters instead of guys taht get on base and hit for average

  76. LGM Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:39 am

    at least you guys have the last place finishing E-A-G-L-E-S to look forward to. Must be tough being a Phillie fan.

  77. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:40 am

    the eagles dont exist

  78. Don M Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:41 am

    no its that the FA guys that get on base and hit for average cost you $10 M per year instead of $5 M…

    honestly, no matter what they do, fans will always find something to complain about

  79. Rob Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:46 am

    I think the Phillies seriously need to get into a fight. I honestly believe that. Too much focus is on all the wrong things. If for a blissful 5 minutes they could forget about their woes and get that adrenaline rush in a brawl supporting their teammates and wooping some ass, I think that maybe their entire attitude would change. Grow some balls, throw at a guys head, and let him come at you. Who the hell cares if you risk any injuries, this team is going nowhere fast. Go fuck somebody up.

  80. Grow up Rob Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:51 am

    Rob, don’t you have a Flyers game to go to? Or maybe a Giants fan to fight? Did you have one too many beers this morning. Come on tough, guy- tell us what you really think. You wonder why us fans have a bad reputation. The Mets are winning by playing well. You think fighting is the answer? Go back to high school, loser.

  81. Geoff Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:55 am

    Of course, Don. THe ONLY thing that stops all that is a championship parade. now, if people complain that the parade wasnt good enough or they didnt jump in the air high enough while they were partaking in their spontaneous intiial spur of the moment world series celebration, then we get into the realm of insanity.

  82. Don M Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 11:58 am

    Rob, I said the same thing in that Marlins series…. Utley leads the league in HBP.. they NEVER relatiate… they need something to make this team feel like a TEAM.

    Not saying go pick a fight, but if someone gets hit once in this Mets series, they need to go get Reyes….who just might get plunked for his 10-minute-round-the bases-celebration from before.

  83. Eb Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 12:35 pm

    Grow Up Rob is probably some dumb hippy.

    They need to retaliate at some point. Nothing brings together a group of guys like a good brewhaha…..well free beer do the same thing but a fight is muhc more entertaining to the fan base.

  84. Eb Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 12:35 pm

    Reyes and Tatis need to be thrown at…Tatis changed his walk up music to superman for the phillies series a couple weeks ago

  85. Rob Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 12:37 pm

    Grow up Rob needs to look at a couple teams and realize that a lil shishkabob never hurt a team when they’ve been in a rut. WhiteSox, Brewers, just to name a couple. Why don’t you grow a pair you sally.

  86. Don M Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 12:38 pm

    is Tatis an HGH guy??

  87. Rob Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 12:39 pm

    PUT IT IN REYES’ EAR!! Or maybe I should just grow up…

  88. Eb Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 12:42 pm

    shishkabob fantatstic term

  89. Rob Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 12:46 pm

    Wouldn’t you love to see that bowling ball Ruiz tackle a dude charging the mound from behind. I think Ruiz is probably a streetfighter.

  90. Rob Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 12:49 pm

    And also, I resent the fact that apparently I’m the type of person that poorly labels Philadelphia fans. Anyone who writes on this blog is clearly 100% supportive of the Phillies, maybe with different ideas or philosophies, but the overall goal. It’s stupid to call someone out for not being a ‘real’ fan just because they have a different philosophy than you. That shit needs to stop. (Of course excluding those lousy metsbloggers that trash up our site)

  91. Mike D. Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 1:06 pm

    A few thoughts. There is still enough time to send Rollins to AAA for attitude readjustment, which I mentioned yesterday. This has nothing to do with his dumb comments about Philly fans, but about his idiotic play. I am so sick of anyone that constantly has to defend him especially the media like when Mitch Williams said he was the best short stop in the league period. He’s probably only the 3rd best short stop in division. Or last night when he dropped the ball up the middle, sure it was a tough play and he might not of got the guy at first, but concentrate and at least have the chance to throw the runner out at first. Plus after that he comes up with two out and a runnner in scoring position and does nothing as usual. Unlike Chase, who committed an error and the next time up singled home a run. I want to know what Rollins said to Manuel in the dugout last night in the 9th. He probably said, “Just get me up and we will win.” Although it should of been, “I hope we don’t get runners on base with 2 outs and me up this inning because I will ground out to the 2nd basemen.” I wish Kevin Stocker was still around.
    Although it was the correct move to make given the dollars he got, I wish Rowand was still on the team to slap Rollins around a bit. He is what is missing from the club house, numbers aside.
    I never want any Phillies player to be MVP again. Rollins being MVP turned him into what we have today, aa .085 hitter over the last 10 games. And it gave Howard all that money and a .110 hitter over the last 10 games.

  92. Grow up Rob Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 1:09 pm

    Way to prove my point.

  93. Grow up Rob Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 1:11 pm

    Yes, Rob, you should grow up. Anyone who truly believes that another player should get beamed in the head is an disgusting person. I take pride in rooting for my team to win. I have no problem with pitching inside but what you are calling for is wrong. Mets fans will read your comment and say “typical Philly fan.” Let’s see if we can beat them fair and square. As for Reyes, hate him all you want but let’s be honest, he is better than Rollins.

  94. Murph Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 2:24 pm

    As a Mets fan I think the difference this year is that you guys don’t have Rowand. He would scare the cr@p out of me everytime he came to bat. The only guy that does that now is Victorino.

  95. Don M Says:
    August 22nd, 2008 at 3:43 pm

    Reyes is better than Rollins, on offense, this year..

    Rollins is still much better than Reyes defensively..

    Reyes is a more dangerous player than Rollins, but it all depends on what you want from your shortstop. Most of the time, Catcher, ShortStop, and CF are not counted on for their offense… so you want the best defensive player you can get at those positions..

    If you look at their CAREER YEARS.. or their best stats from each-any full season:

    Reyes, .300 avg, 19 HR, 81 RBIs, 122 Runs, 194 Hits, 78 Steals.

    Rollins, .296 avg, 30 HR, 94 RBIs, 139 Runs, 212 Hits, 46 Steals.

    In my opinion, Reyes will probably go down as a better player when its all said and done, but I don’t think you can say he’s there now just because Rollins is having a down-year.

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