Phillies Nation

57 Responses to “Preservation Key As Camp Nears”

1. NJ Says:
   February 4th, 2009 at 9:09 am

   This is an opportunity not an emergency. I’m sightly worried about if Feliz will be completely health on his return but this is where the FO and the coaches earn their money, we could add another regular third basement and an Ohman or Beimel but I genuinely think we have what we need already here. Donald should be a shoo-in right now to spot either 2nd or 3rd and between Giles and Ozuna and a right handed infielder to be added like Nomar we have everything to ease out of the gate.

   It could be a blessing in disguise that we have Romero, Feliz and Utley on shortened seasons, we can ride a couple of guys into the ground early without having to worry about the consequences later in the season. Nomar would be a VERY useful peice and I’m very excited about Donald under the circumstances breaking out without having to look over his should for a couple of months, sign an expendable lefty and work Eyre until Romero returns and Eyre settles back into his previous role.

   You can have too much of a good thing and if the guys on this current roster do their job we ARE on the best teams in the NL.

2. Dan L Says:
   February 4th, 2009 at 9:58 am

   I have a very, very difficult time believing that the Phils’ have enough room in their budget to sign a reliever like Ohman who has been reported to looking for a deal as high as $4mill per, AND to sign a name like Nomar who I am almost positive will want something a bit higher than the veteran minimum.

   They are in desperate need of a competent right-handed bat (especially if Tim’s right about the Phillies sitting their primary rightie regularly, Werth) because outside of Jayson Werth, they have NO threat from that side of the plate unless Vic or JRoll are switching.

   However, because the team spending will be hovering around $130 million dollars this year, at least one of their needs–if not both–of bullpen help and a right-handed bat will come from within the organization.

3. KidCarnivore Says:
   February 4th, 2009 at 10:09 am

   The one thing working in the Phillies favor is that there are still a bunch of quality relievers (Ohman, Beimel, etc) available pretty late in the offseason.

4. Kev Says:
   February 4th, 2009 at 10:12 am

   When facing a left handed pitcher the right handed batters are Rollins, Victorino, Werth, Feliz, and Ruiz. So you have 5 out of the 8 main hitters as right handed bats, they will be fine. It doesn’t matter that Ibanez is left handed, everything will be fine, he hits lefties just as well as he hits righties, and will have a better average then Burrell had during his last couple seasons here, while putting up around the same numbers Burrell did.

5. Don M Says:
   February 4th, 2009 at 10:18 am

   I think that using Bruntlett and Jenkins early-and-often is a great plan because they need to feel involved, and try to get into a groove, get some confidence going.. its not ideal, but with some guys banged up, its a smart play, to get people even playing time and make sure your regulars are ready to go for “hitting season”

   Hamels said something in an interview that I loved hearing.. basically one of the things he learned from Moyer was that you don’t always have to go try to strike everyone out.. and some days, your arm just doesn’t feel 100%, so don’t be afraid to rest it, or don’t always feel like you need to over-extend yourself… maybe not want you want to hear from your ACE, but definitely something mature to hear from your 25 year old with a history of arm troubles, and who just pitched more innings than he ever has before.

6. Don M Says:
   February 4th, 2009 at 10:20 am

   One of the things i’d like to see a lot.. is Howard be more willing to take a walk when a LHP is brought in to throw him slop, low & away..

   I’m confident that Werth and Ibanez can make things happen, and maybe neither of them hit as many HRs as Burrell, but they are more likely to get a hit, and move a runner, etc..

   This will be a fun offense to watch, and not as frustrating as in previous years

7. Geoff Says:
   February 4th, 2009 at 10:33 am

   Sometimes you can tell that about hamels as well as lidge. I recall seeing lidge come in a few times and STRICTLY pitch to contract and have like a 10 pitch save. Ive seen Hamels do that before too. Sometimes they want to get it over with quickly and theyll throw sinkers more often even if its not normally part of their pitch arsenal.

   Howard cannot lay off that low and away left handed junk pitch to save himself. He has to lay off that, and he looks really silly faliling at it everytime. Even Les Walrond could get him with that pitch. Hopefully he has worked on that in the offseason because I cant take another season of that…

   It looks like they went hard after wigginton and missed and now are going to make sure they land nomar. will ohman kind of sucks, even though hell strikeout ryan howard with his low and away junk slider that doesnt slide…still joe beimel is from the philadelphia area and youd have to think theyll bring him in but i havent heard anything at all about that. he had a good season last year too.

8. Kev Says:
   February 4th, 2009 at 10:39 am

   How’d i know Geoff was going to bash Howard’s hitting abilities? Guess somethings never change. Also, Lidge throws a Fastball, and a Slider, no Sinker. Also, Hamels throws Fastball, Curve, Circle Change, no Sinker, so i dont know what your talking about with the sinkers. When they pitch to contact and get ground balls, its mainly because their staying out of the heart of the plate, jamming hitters, or just plainly keeping the ball low. It’s not like every pitcher can just throw sinkers when he wants to or everyone would be like Derek Lowe lol.

9. Chuck P Says:
   February 4th, 2009 at 10:40 am

   I’ve been concerned with Feliz since day one. To me, it seemed like a calculated move by the guys in the FO to hide the Feliz injury… by kind of lumping him in with Utley, we didn’t talk much about it and haven’t heard much since. They shrugged it off, suggesting that he wouldn’t miss much time but it’s not a stretch to believe that Feliz’ injury was just as serious, if not more so, than Utley’s. He missed 26 games last season and had it flare-up after the season… to me, that sounds like a nagging back injury which can’t be good for a 3B. Back surgery can be hit or miss and rehab is a rollercoaster… I have known guys (my father being one) that have had similar procedures with great success and I have known guys that have had recurring pain post-op… talk about frustration. You just had your back sliced open and you’re still stuck in the same boat. We probably won’t know whether it was successful until he takes the field and tests it for a few weeks. I’m sure that he has the best doctors and the right genes to ensure a safe and speedy recovery but I would rather see him strengthen his lower back before rushing back on the field.

10. Kev Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 10:44 am

    With Feliz being shaky to start the season, that makes Nomar much more of a necessity. Because he can play basically every infield position besides Catcher. I hope Feliz is fine though, their would be no substitute player for his Defense, my man can pick it.

11. Tim Malcolm Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 10:49 am

    “Sometimes you can tell that about hamels as well as lidge. I recall seeing lidge come in a few times and STRICTLY pitch to contract and have like a 10 pitch save.”

    Isn’t it great, then, that Hamels and Lidge are now under secured contract, so they will pitch to win more likely?

12. Geoff Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 11:01 am

    They will occasionally throw sinkers, pay attention next season…Lidge uses them more than hamels and more often than you think. its just that its thrown at like 95 mph. Blanton throws sinkers more often then those two do also…im well aware of their normal arsenals.

    Yes loccking up hamels and lidge..lidge to keep him and hamels basically to make him happy was mandatory and well done by the front office…i like it when lidge gets it over with quickly. id be happy but surprised to see donald up to fill in for injuries. thats why the phillies want nomar so badly, who can play SS 2B 3B interchangeably. if donald is up to start the season it means hes really dhown them somehting though…i expect nothing at all from marcus giles or ozuna though…i doubt theyll make the opening day roster…

    hamels rarely does it, hell just aim his regular running/moving fastball to jam the hitters inside. but i have seen him throw a sinker before. usually he just uses his three pitches.

    lidge actually does it semi-regularly, youre just not paying attention because brad lidge is awesome. lidge has 4 pitches but predominantly uses just the two (slider, 4 seam fastball) but he also has (2 seam sinking fastball & straight changeup).

13. Geoff Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 11:05 am

    brett myers has 6 pitches acutally. regular 4 seam fastball, slider, cutter, changeup, his 12-6 curveball, and a splitter…

    blanton has 4 seam, slider, changeup, 12-6 curve, 2 seam sinking fastball..

    moyer has like 7 pitches…4 seam, 2 seam/sinker, slider, cutter, curveball, regular chagneup, circle changeup.

    what game are you watching?

14. Georgie Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 11:07 am

    Geoff, Kev seems to have a crystal ball because he apparently knows everything, even the future.

15. Geoff Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 11:15 am

    Yeah he certaintly acts liek he does, at least…

16. Rob E Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 11:26 am

    There was talk during one of the phillies game, that Lidge cna throw a splitter, but lacks the confidence to use it. Anyway who carres his FB and Slider are dominating.

    Pedro was the one player this year that did not go on a Hot streak all year. Hopefully he will come through this year.

17. Manny Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 11:38 am

    I’d be happy to see Jenkins and Bruntlett play a lot in April and May. Like Don said, these guys need to feel involved from the beginning and fill those gaps. But Feliz is a big concern right now. Will Dobbs play 3B full time until he gets better? That would be another lefty in the lineup. We definitely need a RH guy that can play 3B (maybe 2B, and OF too). Wigginton seemed like a great fit — he ended up getting $6 million for 2 years with Baltimore. Very cheap in my opinion. I guess Nomar would be the 2nd best alternative. FO needs to hammer the point that whoever comes WILL GET PLENTY OF PLAYING TIME.

18. peasant Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 12:44 pm

    wiggy didnt sign here because he wanted more playing time, i’d bet against nomar because of his pride, i think the only move we’re going to se is one more reliever, or a really unknown right handed bat

19. Chuck P Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 1:18 pm

    Too bad Griffey’s not RH… saw something on Hot Stove (by the way, the MLB Network is the greatest network, bar none) talking about Griffey and where he might land. They’re saying that he would play for the minimum if he meant that he would get a chance to play for a contender. They also referenced the fact that he played through a bad knee injury last season that required offseason arthroscopic surgery. Two years ago he hit 30 HR…

    Of course, my wheels were spinning… but I couldn’t think of any way that Griffey would fit in here. It would be nice to see arguably the greatest player of our generation play in Philadelphia… even at age 39, the guy is definitely worth the league minimum.

20. Chuck P Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 1:19 pm

    * if it meant

21. Richie Allen Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 1:19 pm

    Its good to hear that everybody is happy if the reserve guys play a lot especially in the early months….But I think that is Charlies management style anyway…I was always amazed to see him play a lot of the bench guys, but it would pay off over the long season .
    I also think we should see the real Jenkins or some of it this year..he has to have more talent than he showed last year.

22. Kev Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 1:25 pm

    Georgie and Geoff, how do i act liek i know everything? Your the one telling me to watch more closely to Hamels and Lidge because they throw sinkers, i watch every single game and have never seen them throw a sinker, if hamels throws it once or twice out of 100 total pitches, i dont think its necessarily in his aresenal and that he feels comfortable using it, but i guess your sure he does. Lidge only throws the fastballs (2&4) and a slider, lol hes a power/strikeout pitcher, he doesn’t throw changes or sinkers?

23. GVeoff Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 1:44 pm

    Hamels throws it less than that eve..the point is that its not like these guys ONLY know how to throw the pitches they throw and nothing more. Lidge used to throw it a lot more until his slider got better. Last year his slider was the best slider in all of baseball, and with a pitch like that you can get a lot done. But I did recall a few saves where the Phillies had been using him every night for 3 or 4 nights before and he needed a rest but had to still pitch. he rolled right out there threw sinkers on the inside part of the plate at like 95mph and was in and out with the save in like 5 minutes. he did that once at home and at least twice on the road.

24. Geoff Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 1:46 pm

    You get in trouble when you have guys liek kendrick who can ONLY throw a sinker well and have 2 or 3 other junk pitches…thats why kendrick didnt last a full season…

25. Kev Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 1:52 pm

    I understand they can throw a bunch of pitches, but do they feel comfortable using it in a game? I doubt it. I’m sure if Hamels wanted to add a slider, sinker, split, he could because he has the type of mentality and work ethic.

    To be honest, im going to have to disagree with you on Lidge and the sinkers, you said he was tired and needed a rest but pitched, so he threw ’sinkers’. They could of looked like sinkers because he didn’t have his usual break on his slider from being tired, etc. He could of had some extra movement on his fastballs, that dipped. It easy to say that a hard diving pitch is a sinker, you may be right in that it was sinking, but i dont necessarily think he went in there ‘throwing sinkers.’ He just pitched to contact, kept the ball out of the heart of the plate and produced some GB and easy outs.

    So just because i disagree with you, doesn’t mean i think i know everything, etc. dont be bitter

26. Georgie Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 1:58 pm

    Kev, reread your first post on this thread, esp the last part. I’m still a little touchy about Pat the Bat being traded, although I think Ibanez will be ok, we don’t know if he’ll be THAT much better than Pat. You just came off a little arrogant about that, sorry, but that’s how I took it.

27. Kev Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 2:03 pm

    The reason i think he will be better is because, he won’t go on those month long slumps, he hits more for an average, while still putting up similar power/rbi numbers. I loved Burrell, he always came up big against the mets, but to me, when Burrell was off, he looked bad at the plate, and i just believe Ibanez won’t go in those slumps like Pat did acouple times a year.

28. Geoff Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 2:07 pm

    Hamels: yes, basically is talented and mentally tough enough to add almost any pitch he wants to his arsenal. Id like for him to add a slider eventually (to even further draw comparisons to steve carlton).

    Lidge: Sliders throws from right handed hitters break down and away from right handed hitters and down and in on left handed hitters. Sinkers or two seamers with a lot of break break down and IN on right handed hitters and down and AWAY from left handed hitters.

    Maybe those few times he had his sinking stuff working so just went out there and used it. I dunno if he was thinking about “throwing sinkers.” but he came out like a madman with a “lets get this over with quickly” mentality. just like at will inducing ground balls. it was one of his more remarkable saves actually…

29. Geoff Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 2:10 pm

    Im pretty sure Ibanez will be a more consistent hitter than Burrell. Ibanez is the type of hitter they needed all last season…

30. Kev Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 2:17 pm

    Exactly Geoff, thats why im looking forward to see what Ibanez does in this offense.

31. Kev Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 2:33 pm

    Geoff, well put about Hamels, if he could adopt a Slider, it wouldn’t be fair

32. Manny Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 3:13 pm

    Re: Ibanez.

    The guy is consistent in putting up good numbers every year… but he is still somewhat streaky and will occassionally fall in slumps. In 2006-2008, his BA in July is .244, but in August .358. So let’s not expect Ibanez to consistently get hits every game… the guy will have his slumps… not Burell-type, but still a good amount. I’m afraid we are setting the bar too high for him.

33. Griffin Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 4:08 pm

    Can we stop saying “Ibanez hits lefties as well as Burrell”. It’s just not true.

    Career stats vs. LHP:

    Ibanez: .268 BA/.322 OBP/ .411 SLG/ .733 OPS
    Burrell: .276 BA/ .410 OBP/ .540 SLG/ .950 OPS

    Burrell is better vs. LHP in EVERY single category. Stop looking at Ibanez’s 197 AB last year against lefties and look at his 1270 career ABs against them.

34. Griffin Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 4:22 pm

    oh and Ibanez is .293 BA/ .355 OBP/ .494 SLG/ .849 OPS against RHP.

    He is a MUCH better hitter against righties than he is against lefties.

35. Chuck P Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 4:48 pm

    Agreed, Manny… he’s not Ted Williams. No one is.

    The point that you make is one of my arguments for Howard, too. Even a good hitter is going to be taking a seat back on the bench more often than he will end up on base…

36. NJ Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 4:54 pm

    Can we just simply put the Burrell/Ibanez arguement into one hits with decent power and the other one sluggs.

37. Bruce Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 5:49 pm

    Who will be Ibanez’s late inning caddy in LF?

38. Griffin Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 6:11 pm

    Bruntlett again, I guess. Here’s hoping that Chollie realizes Ibanez is a terrible fielder.

39. NJ Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 7:05 pm

    Do you really think the Phils didn’t do their research on Ibanez’s fielding??? Why would the front office intentionally sign another 7 inning bat???

    This arguement is about as stupid as it gets

40. Griffin Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 7:07 pm

    NJ, Ibanez is a terrible fielder by every single defensive metric. There is no argument about that.

41. NJ Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 7:13 pm

    Ok we’ve established he aint gonna win a gold glove but I’m pretty sure the guys in the front office did AT LEAST a little bit of background to see if he could work in this outfield.

    The thing that makes me angry is any mistake he makes the boo birds will jump on, give the guy a break and have a little faith.

42. NJ Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 7:17 pm

    Maybe I should of taken a different stance more in line with some of you, we shoulda signed Manny… We shoulda signed Lowe… We shoulda signed CC and complimentary and minor league deals are just a waste of time because there isn’t enough ‘talent’ already on this team.

    Wa wa…

43. Griffin Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 7:25 pm

    Who said anything about booing Ibanez? Amaro overpaid, but it’s over with. That doesn’t change the fact that he’s a terrible fielder.

    How does someone make the leap from “Ibanez is a terrible fielder” to “we should’ve signed Manny and Lowe”?

44. NJ Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 7:30 pm

    Because constantly there’s the opinion we’re getting the wrong guys even though other clubs were clamering for Ibanez. You know the guys gonna get booed, when Phils fans have a pre-disposition against someone they show it and any mistake he makes in the field is going to be booed worse than anyone else.

    Amaro’s being ridiculed here for not getting the skill guys when he’s adding character guys to a batch that’s got enough skill and D.

    I just don’t get why our first instinct isn’t to get behind the moves, question yes but not doubt that the organisation knows what it’s doing.

45. Griffin Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 7:34 pm

    Fair enough. I questioned the Ibanez move but have never said “fire Amaro”. He’ll have the chance to prove himself. Outside of the Ibanez moved, he has done a very good job this offseason.

    I am with you in regards to the booing. I just don’t get it. People booed Burrell for years and it’s just embarassing. Hopefully the fans won’t pick someone out that they will constantly boo (like Ruiz for much of last year).

46. NJ Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 7:34 pm

    ^If we’re smart enough to question Ibanez’s D don’t you think guys probably a hell of a lot smarter than us ask those questions and find answers…?

47. Griffin Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 7:40 pm

    NJ, who is to say that the Phillies’ front office thinks Ibanez is a good defender?

    I hope Ibanez has a monster year and everyone comes on here and says “Griffin is an idiot for ever doubting this signing”. But one thing that I know will be true is that he will be lousy in the field. Then again, LF is the most unimportant defensive position on the diamond

48. NJ Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 7:48 pm

    I doubt they think he’s a good defender but I’m sure they did all they could to idenify roughly how he’d fit into the outfield contingent. It’s not like hey made a yes/no answer, they will have researched the hell out of him before giving him $30m+.

    It’s not fair for people to call you an idition (unless there doing it against Geoff in which sorry but it’s just funny) but it’s not all cut and dry, these guys do their research.

49. Griffin Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 7:51 pm

    True, they look at more stats than we can imagine. I think (and I hope) that we’re in good hands with Amaro. Time will tell.

50. Manny Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 8:10 pm

    NJ, did they research the hell out of Adam Eaton before giving him 24M? I don’t think so. It is OK to question whether the Ibanez signing will work or not. I personally think he is a good replacement for Pat, and I am happy he’s joining our team… but his defense is just as bad (maybe worse) and probably he won’t be as good against lefties as many expect him to be.

51. KM Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 8:33 pm

    I agree with your concern about the Feliz injury. With any back injury, symptoms can linger for a long time, so even if Feliz is back by April 1, he may still miss more time later in the season due to the injury.

    On a side note, Phils are reportedly interested in Joe Beimel, Will Ohman and Randy Flores. I personally like all 3 guys, but Joe Beimel clearly had the best season last year, posting a 2.02 era.

52. Kev Says:
    February 4th, 2009 at 9:54 pm

    As long as Ibanez can catch the routine fly balls to Left Field, what is the big deal? Im with NJ its not like we signed Griffey to roam the outfield, their is no way he can be worse then Burrell. Burrell didnt commit many errors because he never really tried to make a tough play, he would rather let the ball drop in shallow, or whatever, and get the ball in quickly rather then try diving or something which could possibly give him an error. I believe thats the right thing to do, make the necessary play and not hurt your team.

    But why does everyone think he is going to be worse? I just dont understand it, if hes been in the league for 10+ years, he can’t be that horrible. He doesnt have to cover a lot of ground towards center cause thats Victorinos area, so as long as he can make the routine plays, who cares, seems like people are just nit picking, trying to find reasons to doubt Amaro. I agree with NJ, if us ordinary people have issues with Ibanez, im sure the Front Office knows this and did some research. You can’t compare that to Eaton, cause thats a one time bust. He sucks.

53. Youth Baseball Parks Blog » Blog Archive » Fatal Mistake Says:
    February 5th, 2009 at 1:42 am

    [...] Malcolm argues that the Phillies should wait on Chase Utley until his hip is healed. His reasoning is poor, however: One thing the Phillies have proved is April isn’t as [...]

54. NJ Says:
    February 5th, 2009 at 7:30 am

    I can understand bringing up Eaton though they must be a different bunch of people working on the reports for pitchers and positional players, it’s not like Amaro’s doing the legwork. Although we certainly haven’t gotten anywhere near our moneys worth from Eaton there were a lot of stupid contracts for pitchers (Shmidt, Marquis, Silva, Lilly, Meche, Pavano) and few worked.

    Without having any knowledge of advanced scouting I’d say Ibanez will better than Burrell in a reduced area of LF with Vic and Werth able to cover a lot of ground, no-one really cares to much about Gross’s D in Tampa (unless he isn’t hitting) when they have Crawford and Upton to cover most of the ground.

    Apparently things aren’t looking to promising for the Rangers and Sheets because of ‘dollars and cent’s. The closer it gets to camp and edging towards opening day the more appealing Sheets gets, I’m not going to predict him being healthy but he did throw just short of 200 innings last year and that’s a flier I’d take any deal of the week.

55. NJ Says:
    February 5th, 2009 at 7:39 am

    ^If anyone’s going to bring up Burrell vs Ibanez on offense, Burrell was not going to sign for near what he signed for in Tampa. He has the ability to carry a team but his streaks can hurt. Ibanez won’t carry the Phils but he won’t need to be carried, I’m very sure the primary reason for him being here is to bring that character element into the clubhouse to teach guys like Ryan Howard how to grin and bear through those weeks their not on fire, we know he plays smart and it’s the same reason Moyer was retained.

    It’s the addition by subtraction idea, it’s not about Ibanez and Moyer it’s about them making the real core of this team stretch out their success.

56. Chuck P Says:
    February 6th, 2009 at 10:15 am

    Ibanez is a better fielder than Burrell… Burrell is a DH and everyone kind of knew that it was coming to that. Sure, Burrell wanted to come back here because he would have made more coin as a LF but I didn’t see many NL teams jumping to sign Burrell. Ibanez can play LF. He doesn’t have to play gold glove defense because LF defense is not that important in this park (very little ground to cover) and Victorino/Werth limit the amount of ground that he’ll have to cover anyway.

57. Cheap Bats Says:
    March 25th, 2009 at 3:31 pm

    Great quality stuff.

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