Moyer the Stopper – Phillies Nation
2010 Game Recaps

Moyer the Stopper

Leave it Jamie Moyer to come through in the clutch. It was like he was back pitching an NL-East clinching game – when you needed him the most, he came through. Moyer allowed just two solo homers and an additional hit in his superb eight-inning outing. Brad Lidge came on in the ninth to strike out the side, but not before allowing two hits and a run himself. The Phils won 6-3.

Ryan Howard and Jayson Werth hit consecutive homers in the third inning, the 11th of the season for both of them. To all our dismay, these were the first back-to-back homers in 2010 for the Phils. Earlier in the second, Shane Victorino hit a bases-loaded triple off Yankees starter A.J. Burnett to put the Phils up 4-0. The much-maligned Greg Dobbs knocked in the first run and went 1-2 as the DH. The offense was working again but maxed out in the fourth with 6 runs and 6 hits on the board. It proved to be enough tonight.

Carlos Ruiz sat out nursing a sore ankle and an 0-for-22 slump.

The ESPN announcers said the Phillies needed this game to avoid the sweep with Andy Pettitte matched up against Kyle Kendrick tomorrow. I say they still have a chance to take the series.



  1. Pat Gallen

    June 16, 2010 at 11:45 pm

    I just don’t get it. There is no continuity from game to game with anyone on this team anymore. Just no idea what you’ll get from day to day and that’s worrisome.

    I’m happy it’s a win, but I’m a little peeved they couldn’t get more than 6. Call me crazy, but this was a statement game in the making and they failed. Use this as motivation and win the series tomorrow..

  2. Scotch Man

    June 17, 2010 at 12:04 am

    I agree with Pat. Once they knocked Burnett out of the game, I was half expecting 10 more runs to follow. Boone Logan? For one, I have never heard of him. Two, even if he is a lefty, the Phils shouldn’t have looked that asleep with him. But, they are showing signs of life and a win is a win. If the ESPN folks seriously said that this was the game where they needed to avoid a sweep, I’d watch that rhetoric. Kendrick has a way of fooling hitters that have never seen him before. Not counting him out at all.

    Props to Jamie Moyer on a fantastic rebound from an awful start. He’s always learning and as bad as he was the other day, leave it to the veteran to get back in the game with a gem. He’s something else to watch. He has a way of winning when winning is the only option. Tonight was one of those games and he came through.

  3. Chuck

    June 17, 2010 at 12:05 am

    How did they fail, Pat??

    Moyer dominated.

    Back to back HRs.

    Shane’s bases clearing triple…..Clutch!

    Lidge ….3 Ks.

    How else do you want them to make a statement?

  4. Chris.I

    June 17, 2010 at 12:06 am

    Pat I agree with what you said about not knowing what you’ll get from day to day. Other than Jamies Gem, and our offense getting an early lead in the 2nd and 3rd inning…We looked beat up and tired. Maybe its from all the critiscism, maybe its Jimmy, maybe there trying too hard…I don’t know what it is. Im sure if Charlie really knew it would of been corrected by now.

    One important thing I have to point out about this slump is opposing pitching. Pitchers know that were ball bashers. Its what made us world phucking champs. If you throw the ball anywhere in the zone, we beat you everytime. Pitchers figured us out…We have ZERO PATIENCE at the plate, and pitchers throw us JUNK balls all day long. I noticed pitchers always get away with first ball fast ball straight down the plate (which we need to take advantage of from time to time) than everything is everywhere but in the zone and they swing everytime. They need to get their shit together

  5. Pat Gallen

    June 17, 2010 at 12:14 am

    Dont get me wrong, Moyer certainly dominated. That was awesome to see. The offense is who I meant. I guess I shouldn’t be too hard on them. Valdez is a black hole at the plate and the DH spot isnt working.

  6. Jeff

    June 17, 2010 at 12:16 am

    Your wrong Pat. We have seen the Phillies put up 12 and then not hit for a while. Baby steps. I will take 6 tonight.

  7. Chris.I

    June 17, 2010 at 12:17 am

    Call me crazy but I think right now would be a good time to take advantage of the DH and call Brown or Mayberry up because Francisco just doesnt seem to be helping out much.

  8. Pat Gallen

    June 17, 2010 at 12:40 am

    Jeff, they havent been able to go for the throat. We’ve seen 6 runs here, 5 runs there, 10 runs over there. But nothing sustainable. They had 6 runs early on in the game and couldn’t build on it.

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  10. That Balls Outta Here

    June 17, 2010 at 12:42 am

    I don’t think there’s anybody on that bench who can step into a DH role without lukewarm groans (Francisco) or panicked screams (Dobbs–though yeah, I saw that hit tonight too). So that’s never going to be a real hot spot as we stumble out of 2010 Interleague play.

    My roommate is a Yankees fan and when he saw Boone Logan warming up he called him “the human white flag.” Clearly he’s not a guy the Yanks trot out there because he’s got undeniable stopping power. And… we couldn’t hit him… but we could hit Burnett. What the… eff…

    Oh well. W. ‘Nuff said.

  11. Chuck

    June 17, 2010 at 12:50 am

    SO WHAT, guys!! We won. Decisively.

    I don’t know….but to me a 6-3 win ……is a VERY GOOD win.

    Nothing cheap about it. There was a little of everything….GREAT pitching, CLUTCH hitting (Vic!!!), your closer getting it done.

    I am EXTREMELY happy…especially with the prospect of a very tough night tomorrow night with Pettitte.

  12. Brian Sr. of CO

    June 17, 2010 at 12:54 am

    Honestly I believe the reason more runs were not put on the board was Shane Victorino’s bonehead moment. He stole 2nd…Awesome, but when you have a DEEP fly to the Warning track, you MUST tag and move forward. It was a mistake that didnt cost them anything except more of a “statement”. Either way putting 6 runs on the board against the Yankees regardless of who it is, is a statement.

  13. Jeff of Nova

    June 17, 2010 at 12:58 am


    Need to remember the Yankees bullpen is probably the best in baseball if not near the top, so scoring 6 was good

  14. karen

    June 17, 2010 at 1:08 am

    Jamie moyer is just amazing though. for his age and all……awesome. thanks jamie.

  15. Brooks

    June 17, 2010 at 1:21 am

    Keith and I just got back from the game. Rough atmosphere.
    We did sit in the center right bleachers (I have not seen those seats in a few decades) and teh crowd there was pretty rough. Lots of Phillies fans but lots of nonsense too. Fights to our left and to our right, drunks all around and lots and lots of cops.
    To the game – Moyer as usual did not really have anything special. He was just getting the outside calls like he needs. The hit that Dobbs had looked like it should have been a double, perhaps he forgot what to do on the basepaths its been so long. And, he knocked in a run! Cano hit a hr that landed probably 20 some rows deep in right center, it was a smash – Jaysons hr was a line drive and Ryans shot was probably to the deepest part of the park.
    I too was expecting more from the offense especially after Burnett exited. Nary a hit.
    All in all, good game. Would I go back to NY for another? Only for a special occasion, like post season. Hey, the train ride up ($15), the parking at the train station ($7), the food ($11 for a 24 oz beer, which I like bigger beers..) it got a little expensive. No rain though, good win too.

  16. Andrew from Waldorf

    June 17, 2010 at 1:59 am

    Lets hope they snapped out of it.
    when they do they could explode. Which will be great
    Or they could stink all year.
    Tomorrow will tell alot about heart.
    Im excited to watch a game for the first time in awhile. It got pretty bad there for about a month.

  17. jt

    June 17, 2010 at 2:40 am

    win is a win but i’m still concerned becaue they were shut down by a bunch of no name guys i mean who is boone logan we a few other people said that to each other i was expecting them to put up at least 10 myself once burnett left the game…i think kendrick will struggle like he always does no way he shuts down a lineup like the yankees and hopefully they get his out of the starting rotation.

  18. Adrian

    June 17, 2010 at 3:12 am

    This is an offense that collected more than 10 hits in 12 of the first 17 games in May. They’re going to need to get more than six on a consistent basis before I start to believe they’re out of this funk.

  19. Tracey

    June 17, 2010 at 4:59 am

    I’m with Jeff on this one: I don’t want to see them get 10 runs tonight and then get blanked for the rest of the week. Baseball is pass-fail; all they need to do is get 1 run more than the other team. They did their job (for a change); they got runs in more than one inning (for a change). I’m pleased with what I saw.

    I love that Jamie Moyer makes history every time he does something good just by virtue of being old. He was the oldest guy to throw a complete game shut-out. Now he’s the oldest guy to beat the Yankees. OLD GUYS ROCK!!!

  20. Ted Bell

    June 17, 2010 at 5:08 am

    Chase Utley’s voodoo shrine worked to perfection. That’s the only reasonable explanation for Moyer beating the Yankees.

    I’m Ted Bell.

  21. DMarley

    June 17, 2010 at 6:26 am

    “Call me crazy, but this was a statement game in the making and they failed.”

    Put on your statement-receiving pants and get back to us. This was a strong team win.

    “Moyer as usual did not really have anything special”

    Yeah, nothing special about that guy 😉

  22. Jeff Y.

    June 17, 2010 at 6:30 am

    How does Jamie Moyer get lit up like a Christmas tree against the Bosox, and then look like Steve Carlton against the Yanks???

  23. The Dipsy

    June 17, 2010 at 7:37 am

    I have a concern about Brad Lidge. Ot maybe its an observation. His fastball topped out at about 92 last night. While that speed is way down from what he used to throw his movement is still decent. But it appears that this year he has added a pitch and that is: the slider that actually breaks in for a strike. Its a good pitch. He threw one at 84 which also looked a little change uppy. Did anyone notice this? Has Brad changed the way he has pitched? Don’t get me wrong: I know that if he could ever throw 97 again that it would be fastball and slider in the dirt again. But right now he appears to have a fastball and two different sliders. If he pitches that way, I would think that he would have to stay ahead in the count because at 3-2, he doesn’t have that go to fastball to go to because he can’t throw it past anyone who knows its coming. Thats said, he has been effective and I am happy for that.

    The Dipsy

  24. Dave

    June 17, 2010 at 7:54 am

    He’s always thrown the 2 sliders. I’m trying to be patient with him since he hasn’t pitched much this year. He looks better than last year at least.

  25. The Dipsy

    June 17, 2010 at 7:59 am

    I don’t know Dave. Let me be more precise: He now uses that “strike-slider” regularly, as opposed to a change of pace from his fastball.

    The Dipsy

  26. Chuck

    June 17, 2010 at 8:01 am


    Three words, brotha:

    WELL LOCATED fastball.

  27. The Dipsy

    June 17, 2010 at 8:07 am

    I agree. Would you agree he has changed his pitching M.O. somewhat?

    The Dipsy

  28. Chuck

    June 17, 2010 at 8:12 am

    I don’t know. Possibly. I will have to really look closely next time he pitches.

    I DO know one thing though….his confidence is there. I mean, he could have totally buckled in last night with Posada at the plate and runners on and a run already in. But he didn’t…..and that’s a VERY good thing!!

    No saying he will be perfect in save situations for the rest of the year. But 4 for 4 is a nice start and a shot in the arm that this team needs right now.

  29. George

    June 17, 2010 at 8:16 am

    So what if they didn’t get more than six? How many times does a team actually lose a game because they “only scored six?” One should save being “peeved” for games where they look pathetic for all nine innings, don’t get any steals or home runs, and don’t get any bases loaded hits, and make stupid mental errors. So what if Boone Logan pitched well; he wouldn’t have pitched at all if they hadn’t hit the crap out of Burnett.

  30. The Dipsy

    June 17, 2010 at 8:18 am

    I’ll tell ya what, if he’s gonna throw that get over slider than he better keep it from breaking down and in to the lefties cause they’re gonna crush it. He should try and break it in over the outside of the plate againt them. A-Rod crushed one last night.

    The Dipsy

  31. Chuck

    June 17, 2010 at 8:26 am

    Good point.

    I wouldn’t say he dominated last night….because he put runners on and did give up a run. But he got it done. And didn’t crumble. That’s all you can really ask for from your closer.

    And, to further these comments about whether or not the Phillies should have scored more last night….. Again, like I said earlier. a 6-3 win….over the defending WS champion Yankees… a VERY GOOD win. I could really care less if they didn’t get more runs. Moyer was awesome and Lidge got it done.

  32. Ted Bell

    June 17, 2010 at 8:45 am

    I’m not understanding the “it’s a win, but I wish they scored more runs” sentiment either. When you come away with a win against all odds in a game that Jamie Moyer starts against the Yankees, you should simply thank the baseball Gods and try to figure out how to get through the next game with KK on the mound. Hopefully, the baseball Gods will be generous once more. Let’s hope Chase left his Voodoo shrine intact also.

    I’m Ted Bell.

  33. teejvee

    June 17, 2010 at 9:20 am

    I think I can explain it Ted.

    Everybody is looking for signs that this team slump is over.

    A big, clutch (emphasis) EXTRA BASE (emphasis) hit , a couple homers…yeah that looks like it might be it.

    Or was it just an aberration?

    Just the night before, we saw how a good team does it- they pile on.

    The Phillies quickly reverted to their old self.

    Weak groundouts in the clutch ( Ibanez).
    Nothing at bats.
    Utley displaying his Valdez power- i.e. none.( That last AB was typical . Hit it solid- only reached the warning track.)

    So the skeptical among us are still skeptical.

  34. Pat Gallen

    June 17, 2010 at 9:31 am

    Thank you TEEJVEE. You hit the nail on the head as to why my comments earlier were somewhat subdued. Sure, its a win against a very good team. But we need to know that the slump is completely over. Going for the kill would have been great and against a team this good, could have a trickle down effect.

  35. metsfan4life

    June 17, 2010 at 9:38 am

    hahah phillie fans ur team sux ur lucky u won last night…i am goin to the game tonight just to see that no good piece of shit Kendrick get bombed!!!

  36. metsfan4life

    June 17, 2010 at 9:38 am

    and o yea Mets will sweep Cleveland too!!

  37. Chuck

    June 17, 2010 at 9:40 am

    Maybe the WFC in 2008 was an “aberration” too.

    And that “good team” you are referring to…the Yankees from the night before…looked befuddled against Moyer. They sure “piled it on” last night, huh?

    Seriously, I really don’t know what some of you people are looking for.


    Look…it will be tough to win tonight. No question. Andy Pettitte is like the best pitcher in the league. KK just needs to pitch his game and hold his own. And the Phillies need to be patient at the plate.

    Still…let’s say they lose. That’s a 2-4 road trip against the two of the best teams in the AL.

    So there is no reason to think that with Halladay and Hamels pitching at home that they can’t take 2 of 3 from the Twins. Let’s figure 2 of 3 from the Indians…at least…..and we’ll maybe assume they have problems with the Jays, losing 2 of 3.

    That’s a 7-8 record for this stretch of interleague play…basically .500 ball. Not bad considering the Phillies history with interleague.

    Then it’s the Reds, a good team…but let’s figure 2 of 3 there. Maybe between the Jays and Reds it’s a 3-3 stretch somehow.

    That’s a 12-14 June record. About what it was the last two seasons.

    By then, J-Roll SHOULD be back and this lineup all of a sudden looks MUCH different heading into the second half of the season.

  38. metsfan4life

    June 17, 2010 at 9:41 am

    how many of u Phillie fans actually get SNY on ur TV??

  39. teejvee

    June 17, 2010 at 9:48 am

    be prepared metsfan4life.

    Kendrick has secretly been working on a screwball. Tonight is the night he may unveil it.

  40. metsfan4life

    June 17, 2010 at 9:50 am

    good luck with a-rod cano and swish i dont think kendricks screwball would make a huge difference

  41. Ben

    June 17, 2010 at 9:51 am

    i will say this, it ticks me off that people call for moyer’s head every bad start he has, and then his good starts are chalked up to a good outing.

    he is a consistent starter looking at a whole years worth of work. you can peg him for 10 wins at the beginning of the year, every year. whenever anyone complains about him its that he throws too slow and he is too old, like those are the end all be all things to getting people out.

    congrats to moyer on another fine win, #265 in his career. terrific back end of the rotation pitcher and mentor.

  42. teejvee

    June 17, 2010 at 9:53 am

    Maybe the WFC in 2008 was an “aberration” too.

    And that “good team” you are referring to…the Yankees from the night before…looked befuddled against Moyer. They sure “piled it on” last night, huh?”

    Give it up chuck.
    You can’t argue your way out of shitty performance.
    2008 is past history. This is 2010.

    It’s pretty cut and dried.

    Even good teams have bad nights.

    End even bad teams have good nights.

    Right now, the Yankees are the former and the Phillies are the latter.

    That could all be different by next week , but then we’ll have a different discussion.

  43. Dave

    June 17, 2010 at 9:53 am

    Dipsy…maybe he’s throwing it more often than before, but I’ve seen him throw it since he’s been here. He likes to throw it on the first pitch to guys who sit first pitch fastball….someone like Jorge Cantu for example.

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  45. metsfan4life

    June 17, 2010 at 10:21 am

    Whoever thinks Kyle Kendrick is going to get torched tonight give me a HELL YEA!!!! I think while im at the game i’ll have a couple of steveweisers and have a toast with Stone Cold

  46. phillyphaith

    June 17, 2010 at 10:39 am

    metsfan4life, if you’re such a big mets fan shouldn’t you be at staying at home to watch the mets game??? and not going to see the yanks/phils game….

  47. Kate

    June 17, 2010 at 10:59 am

    I noted that Michael Barkann was back in his pre-game seat beside Ricky Bo right where he belongs. Coincidence?

    I still say they had Jimmy Rollins on speakerphone or web cam before the game.

    Moyer dominated; can’t say enough good things about his performance last night and what it meant to go up against the Yankees. He blanked Jeter.

    Howard and Werth got their swing back and Victorino delivered big-time on that bases-clearing triple. Even Dobbs

    We can analyze this win all we want and realize there are still some pretty big problems (the big hole at the bottom of the line-up being number one on the list), but I’m just enjoying the fact that the Yankees won’t be sweeping us whatever happens tonight. In the middle of this slump, that’s saying something.

  48. Bob in Bucks

    June 17, 2010 at 11:21 am

    Keep up the growsing – “not enough runs” yada yada. The Phils won and they did fine. Like I said yesterday, I knew we were coming out of it because all the panic buttons were pushed!

    The Yankees are a fine team – taking one out of three in their park is fine – 2 out of 3 would be a surprise – especially since we threw our 1-5-6 pitchers against their 1-2-3.

    Calm down folks, it is baseball, nothing is consistent from game to game. That is why they play ’em.

  49. ray

    June 17, 2010 at 11:33 am

    Metsfan4life is more interested in the phillies than the choking mutts. He knows the ending to the story so he’s enjoying this while he can so when the season is inevitably over for him in august he can post under a different name for a different team.

  50. The Dipsy

    June 17, 2010 at 11:51 am

    “Everything happens for a reason. Unless it doesn’t”. Figure that one out and you’ll have the answer to the slump.

    The Dipsy

  51. Bart Shart

    June 17, 2010 at 12:22 pm

    Wow…Dipsy….that is sooo profound. Keep up the philosophy.

  52. Don M

    June 17, 2010 at 1:13 pm

    Since everyone said yesterday morning that the season was over, and we were going to get swept by the Yankees , im still not sure that we even won that game last night ..?

  53. Papps

    June 17, 2010 at 1:21 pm

    Phillies Phans come and lets discuss the Phillies at

    I’m glad we beat the Yankees last night. Its time for us to get back on track to the World Series again!!

  54. Willie

    June 17, 2010 at 1:40 pm

    Is ray serious??? “Choking Mutts”…. Whose in third place again?

  55. phillyboy

    June 17, 2010 at 1:47 pm

    did anyone else hear the espn ann. basically say that scouts are saying since the binocular thing that is the reason for chase’s struggles!!!boy that pissed me off!!! i can not wait for chase to catch fire and show these a-holes something!!

  56. Brooks

    June 17, 2010 at 2:23 pm

    Jeff Y, Moyer’s success or failure rides a lot on the umpires. If the ump is generous with the corners Jamie has a pretty good outing. He needs those corners.
    That is why I said earlier that Jamie did not show anything out of the ordinary for him, nothing special – just his typical control and mastery over the corners that he is given.

  57. Don M

    June 17, 2010 at 2:34 pm

    I think the reason for Chase’s struggles, its that contrary to popular belief, he’s not the best player in baseball .. … he’s an above-average player, who plays the right way ..

    he’s a career .293 hitter, who averages 29 HRs a season in his career, and used to be bad in the field, now he’s probably above-average

    Like ever hitter in the game, other than Albert Pujols, he’ll have bad stretches at times, but he’ll do everything he can to help his team win

  58. Don M

    June 17, 2010 at 2:35 pm

    What is said about Moyer, is the same with EVERY pitcher… looks what happened with Halladay when the low-strike, and the pitches on the corners weren’t called “STRIKES” …it forces you to leave more over the plate, and belt-high .. and those are the locations that get ROCKED by MLB hitters

  59. The Dipsy

    June 17, 2010 at 2:39 pm

    Don M? Hello? Above average? Just above average? Would you call him a “star player”?

    The Dipsy

  60. The Second John

    June 17, 2010 at 3:07 pm

    Scott Mathieson got called up today. Bastardo to DL.

    How can you call Chase Utley just an above average player? He has been on of the best players in baseball for the last few years.

  61. Georgie

    June 17, 2010 at 3:09 pm

    Don M, interesting point about the strike zone…..there was a world of difference between strike zones For Roy’s game v Jamie’s. Not taking any credit away from Jamie, but alot of pitches that were called strikes last night were balls for Roy, and that changes the tenor of the game from the first inning. Roy’s frustration with the strike zone was quite obvious, for a guy who usually keeps his cool, he was TICKED OFF, and I can’t say I blame him.

    Let’s hope the guys are coming around now, and KK keeps us in the game tonight.

  62. Don M

    June 17, 2010 at 3:27 pm

    I wouldn’t call him a “star fielder” … overall, he’s a star, an All-Star, etc … aobve-average players isn’t an insult is it?

    but I’m one of the few not ready to place in the Hall of Fame, or label him the Greatest Secondbaseman of all time

    the past 3 years:

    .292, 33 HRs, 104 RBI
    .282, 31 HRs, 93 RBI
    ……and so far this year, .260, 10 HR, 26 RBI
    which puts him on pace for lower numbers yet again.. if he’s hurt, as soon as Rollins gets back he should take a few days off

  63. Chuck

    June 17, 2010 at 4:15 pm

    Chase Utley works really hard at being a major leage player. REALLY HARD. Both physically AND mentally. He’s like the first one at the park every day. His work ethic is something that 90% of all other players should look at once in awhile.

    I think that because he works hard….he’s an “above average” player. He’s a “star”.

    But my thinking is that NO….he won’t be in the Hall of fame someday. He doesn’t have the numbers to support his election now…..and at the pace he’s on…..he probably won’t when he retires. I know that will send shock waves throughout the Delaware Valley, but it’s true.



    So you’re saying that the Phillies are a “bad team that had a good night”

    Wow….talk about negativity!

    I really don’t know how most of you can really enjoy being fans if all you’re gonna do is whine and b*tch all the time.

  64. Phan in the outfield

    June 17, 2010 at 4:16 pm

    After being harranged with a barrage of ‘The Yankees Are God and The Phillies Stink’ from the lame YES channel commentators (Al Leiter is one), and after the Phils appeared as though they’d decided to throw the game in the last few innings, and we STILL won, I sat disbelieving for a min. (I think a tear slipped out when Howard & Werth hit the back-to-back HRs.) It seriously seems like forEVER since something positive happened for this team. The look on Ryan Howard’s face after JDub hit his homer said it all.

  65. teejvee

    June 17, 2010 at 4:23 pm


    “So you’re saying that the Phillies are a “bad team that had a good night”

    Wow….talk about negativity! ”

    More like reality

    May I ask. What team have you been watching the past month?

    Yea they are a bad team. BAD. Can’t buy an big hit .
    Homers come as often as World Cup goal. NO evidence Utley and Ibanez
    are going to start hitting any.
    We’ll see about Werth and Howard.

    That’s the state of state. TODAY.

    Check back in a week

  66. Chuck

    June 17, 2010 at 4:23 pm

    “Just get me to the plate, boys” !!!!!!!

  67. The Dipsy

    June 17, 2010 at 4:31 pm

    Chuck, I hate to tell you this, but if you extrapolate his numbers he will, without question, be in the Hall of Fame. Best Second Baseman of last 50 years???? Here:

    Morgan, Ryno, Alomar, Utley. Feel free to add.

    The Dipsy

  68. Chuck

    June 17, 2010 at 4:31 pm

    Can’t buy a big hit, you say??

    Gee, I guess that bases-clearing triple from Shane was just in my dreams then.

    teej….we’ve been over this on this site…..the Phillies are in a slump. Just like in 2008 and 2009. Both years we had similiar records at this point in the schedule.

    Were those “bad” teams?? You know, the teams that went on the the WS both years??

    So I guess then, if the Phillies win 5 of their next 7, then they are then a “good’ team again. (7 games….you know….”check back in a week”).

    Whatever happened to a good team just being in a slump?? That doesn’t make them a bad team….it just means they aren’t playing up to their ability AT THE TIME.

  69. The Dipsy

    June 17, 2010 at 4:32 pm

    And Rod Carew, if he’s not a 1B.

    The Dipsy

  70. Chuck

    June 17, 2010 at 4:47 pm

    Sandberg played for 16 seasons. Chase has 8 under his belt..6 as a full-time player. He’s currently 31. Let’s assume he plays for another 8 years for a total of 16.

    Sandberg: 2386 hits
    .285 BA
    .344 OBP
    282 HR
    1061 RBI

    Utley so far: 1036 hits
    .293 BA
    .379 OBP
    171 HR
    611 RBI

    If you simply double the numbers to extrapolate it out, Chase is higher in some categories and lower in others.

    Here’s my argument though…..I don’t think Chase will keep that pace up. I don’t think he will reach those numbers. We are already seeing a decline this year. Now maybe that will corrrect itself….but I just don’t think you can say he a “lock” for the HoF because of his numbers.

  71. Chuck

    June 17, 2010 at 4:53 pm

    Joe Morgan played for 22 years. 2517 Hits and a BA of .271. I don’t think Chase has 14 more years in him….so you really can’t compare him to Morgan.

    Alomar isn’t in the HoF.

    Rod Carew is in a different league than any of these guys…. .328 BA and over 3000 hits. Totally different.

  72. PaulyPizza

    June 17, 2010 at 5:09 pm

    KK going tonight. Predicting another pimp smack on the Stankies. Pettite is a tough opponent with PED or without I suppose. But we got Polanco (prognosticating as the hero of the night!)
    ‘where my pizza at?’
    The Nation league cries ‘ NO Blankton!’

  73. The Dipsy

    June 17, 2010 at 6:04 pm

    Exactly my point Chuck. Alomar is not in the HOF. There are barely any great second basemen from the last 50 year but Chase is among them. If Chase ends his career with 2500 hits, 350 hrs, .285 along with all the runs he scores AND his importance to perennial WS teams (so far one winner), he’s in no problem. See Pee Wee Reese. If not for being on those Dodgers teams, he’s not in. I’m not saying that Chase is better than Morgan or Carew, although a case could be made that he could be. Bottom line, his stats and post seasons, AS A 2B, will get him in. Look at the list of 2B’s in the HOF. He’s better than half of them. Could he break down early? Sure. Will they move him to the OF eventually? Probably. I think he gose to the Hall and is one of the top 5 2B of the last 50 years.

    The Dipsy

  74. Brooks

    June 17, 2010 at 6:21 pm

    I’m listening to Jayson Werth on the MLB TV doing an interview before tonight’s nationally televised game. Harold Reynolds & Greg Amsinger made the mistake of chiding Jayson about his beard – what a mistake.
    Jayson jestured, looked pissed and almost walked away until Harold caught (duh) what was going on and said, “Lets talk baseball..” to which Jayson replied, “Please!”

    But Jayson was open about the teams frustration and said for the mostpart we are being positive but it’s been tough…

  75. Brooks

    June 17, 2010 at 6:28 pm

    How can you say after one portion of one season, that Chase cannot keep up the pace that has elevated him to the elite status of one of today’s premier second basemen?
    Chuck, reality man – one month of a bad slump does not mean the end of a baseball player.
    And Dipsy, Alomar will make it into the HOF. 10 GG, 11 straight AS appearances – amazing defensive second baseman.

  76. Chuck

    June 17, 2010 at 6:40 pm

    Chase will not end his career with 2500 hits. So far he has 1036. If you double that it’s just over 2000…..and that’s saying that he plays another 8 years….at the same pace. I think he will slow down. If fact, I really wonder if he plays 8 more seasons.

    If he played for 22 seasons like Morgan did….and put up consisten numbers….MAYBE he comes close to Morgan’s stats…..but I doubt it.

    Carew….there is NO WAY that Chase Utley can even be mentioned in the same sentence as Rod Carew. NO WAY.

  77. Chuck

    June 17, 2010 at 6:47 pm

    Yeah…Alomar gets in at some point. 2724 hits in 17 seasons. .300 BA.

    But that just emphasizes Utley. At 8 seasons (not quite 8) he has 1036 hits. Double that and it’s 2072. Add another 175 hits for the 17th season and it’s about 2257. That’s still almost 500 hits less than Alomar.

    I just don’t see Utley being in the same group as Alomar.

  78. Chuck

    June 17, 2010 at 6:48 pm

    not sure why the smiley face is on my post. I HATE those things.

  79. Bart Shart

    June 17, 2010 at 7:05 pm

    Let’s not forget Jeff Kent, Lew Whitaker, Nellie Fox (last 50 years), and
    Mickey Morandini (kidding here).

  80. The Dipsy

    June 17, 2010 at 7:55 pm

    Those guys are not close to Utley. Kent was a first baseman playing 2B. Chuck, Chase has played the equivalent of six seasons. I really doubt that he will retire at 37 or whatever after 8 more seasons. That said, yes, he can make 2500 hits. You should look at Joe Morgan’s (one of my all time favs, BTW) stats excluding 75 and 76 and then tell how you feel about his career. Morgan is in because he had a spectacular 5 year run on back to back WS winners. Alomar was a great player but he should not have spit on that ump and he played in San Diego and Toronto. Great player. He’ll get in. Nellie Foz, Bobby Doerr, Bill Mazeroski. Those guys are a joke compared to Chase. As to the Rod Carew comparison, he was a singles hitter, great bunter, good baserunner. Wade Boggs with speed. I would take Utley over Carew as a total package. Carew never won a thing. Great player, though. Utley hits for average, hits for power, runs, field and throw. Carew did two of those.

    The Dipsy

  81. Brooks

    June 17, 2010 at 8:00 pm

    I thought it was something “special” that you had to get the emoticons…
    Anyway, in reality at this point if Chase were to make it into the HOF it would take at least 1 more WS ring, a few GG, AS appearances and maybe even 1 or more MVP awards. And I do not see the MVP awards in his future – I think collectively we as Phillies fans thought this might be happening but, not any longer.

  82. Chuck

    June 17, 2010 at 8:02 pm


    No way he makes 2500 hits. He has just over 100 now. He’s never had 200 for a season. He would have to play for 11 or 12 seasons to get there. Not a chance.

  83. Brooks

    June 17, 2010 at 8:11 pm

    Dipsy, thanks for bringing up the legacy that most of the people on this blog remember about Roberto Alomar – the spitting incident ???
    The man had a flat tire, he blew his gasket – he lost control – one time in his career. He was involved in the communities he lived in, he was charitable, well liked and respected and then this. And it will never be lived down because inevitably, someone will slap the one liner in there about a 2 minute episode in a great players career that has him branded forever as “the guy who spit on the umpire John Hirschbeck”

  84. The Dipsy

    June 17, 2010 at 9:21 pm

    Brooks, I think Roberto is great. I am just telling you why I think it may take him a little longer to get in the Hall than it otherwise would.

    The Dipsy

    P.S. Spitting on an umpire is pretty bad. BUT what the umpire said to him (allegedly) was reprehensible

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